RSSCable provider looks to create Bill of Rights for P2P users
By Ed Oswald | Published April 16, 2008, 11:28 AM
Comcast and partner Pando Networks are leading an effort to push the industry to adopt some common practices when it comes to dealing with file sharers.
Pando is providing the cable operator with its Network Aware P2P technology so that it can analyze traffic moving through its network. Comcast plans to publicize those test results so that other cable operators can optimize their networks to better handle P2P traffic.
This follows what could be called a truce between Comcast and BitTorrent, who are trying to reach an amicable solution for controlling peer to peer traffic without outright throttling.
Such a document would essentially be a list of best practices for network operators, as well as what choices and controls consumers should have been using P2P.
Work on the Bill of Rights, combined with its Pando test and the BitTorrent partnership, will help the company move towards its goal of a protocol-agnostic network management structure by the end of this year, it said.
"Working together, Comcast and Pando can help lead the discussion about what consumers should expect in terms of a 'P2P Bill of Rights and Responsibilities' for P2P users and ISPs," Comcast technology chief Tony Werner said. "Doing so is in the best interest of everyone involved -- ISPs, P2P companies and consumers."
You have the right to pay your bill. If you give up that right anything you try to surf to or use on the internet will not work.
You have the right to be charged exhorbitant rates for substandard internet bandwidth.
You have the right to be silent about the quality of service you're getting. If you give up that right, we have the right to put you through the paces of talking to an outsourced helpdesk in another country with people you can barely understand in an effort to get you to give up calling.
You have the right to be ignored by us as we take your money and turn a blind eye to spammers working from our networks to fill your email boxes with viagra and junk bond ads.
You have the right to be cut off at any time if you use enough bandwith that you've already paid for (according to the contract that we have with you by doing business with you) because we cannot really sell you the bandwidth you're buying because we don't have the capacity to provide everyone what they paid for.
You have the right to the common internet ports and services we approve of. If you want to use any other ports or services, we have the right to block you so that your Vonage line doesn't work as well as our VOIP service, which we will gladly charge you twice what Vonage does for half the services.
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|ALL of those statements are SPOT ON! Its sad...
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|*yawn*
You have the right to be cut off at any time if you use enough bandwith that you've already paid for (according to the contract that we have with you by doing business with you) because we cannot really sell you the bandwidth you're buying because we don't have the capacity to provide everyone what they paid for.
No residential/consumer ISP contracts bandwidth. Merely availability and a max throughput.
Want VOIP, the ability to run Servers, and guaranteed service levels?
www.corp.att.com/businesscenter/
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|Actually you're wrong on that. When I was in Houston I signed up for their (Time Warner Cable) premium speed when it was released, which at that time was 8mbit down 512k up. They guaranteed that speed as long as the other end supported it (of course, that's fine with me).
When you pay for a service that is advertised as a certain bandwidth, that bandwidth better be available. Period. If not, it's false advertising.
I understand that it takes *both* ends of a connection to utilize the bandwidth at the highest speeds, of course, but still, you are paying for something with an expectation. The problem is, the cable company is like the airline industry, they oversell frequently.
Plus, the abiity to use VOIP with any provider, the ability to run game servers for limited periods of time (I'm with you on the dedicated business lines for extended periods of time for real server bandwidth, not the occasional "ten man frag hosted by a buddy" situation), etc are something that everyone should have the right to.
Blocking VOIP is wrong, right up there with sending reset packets to throttle bittorrent. When they say "unlimited" they better mean "unlimited".
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|They guaranteed that speed as long as the other end supported i
Bull. Sorry, but it is. The guarantee referred either to availability or "max" bandwidth. No residential ISP guarantees bandwidth availability. Period. It requires an SLA only available to business users.
When you pay for a service that is advertised as a certain bandwidth, that bandwidth better be available. Period. If not, it's false advertising.
Then I suggest you look more closely at the adverts. I have yet to see one that is not promising "up to" or "unlimited" (in reference to availability, as opposed to on-demand such as Dial-Up).
I understand that it takes *both* ends of a connection to utilize the bandwidth at the highest speeds, of course, but still, you are paying for something with an expectation.
Expectation!=guarantee.
The problem is, the cable company is like the airline industry, they oversell frequently.
True. I'd rather have them do that on my residential connection than charge me $1500 a month for a T3.
Plus, the abiity to use VOIP with any provider, the ability to run game servers for limited periods of time (I'm with you on the dedicated business lines for extended periods of time for real server bandwidth, not the occasional "ten man frag hosted by a buddy" situation), etc are something that everyone should have the right to.
You are confusing "right" with "want". Companies sell game server hosting for a reason. As for VOIP, you are more than welcome to have a go at it, but without an SLA, you're in for a crap-shoot. The internet simply was not designed for "real-time" applications.
Blocking VOIP is wrong, right up there with sending reset packets to throttle bittorrent. When they say "unlimited" they better mean "unlimited".
...and when you can prove they purposefully block it and guaranteed to not do so, you'll have something. Until then, it's just speculation. AFAIK, no-one has proven VOIP blocking yet, it's just an "OMG! What if...!" scenario.
When they say "unlimited" they better mean "unlimited".
I am beginning to think you are incapable of reading fine print or seeing more than what is BIG and BOLD. "Unlimited" refers to availability of the connection, not the speed or the total amount of bandwidth.
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|Sounds to me like Comcast is scared of getting slapped by a class action, losing the suit, then being told they cannot throttle P2P traffic, thus setting precedence. Well, we can't have that, can we? It's better to go lobbying under the pretense of "trying to reach an amicable solution for controlling peer to peer traffic without outright throttling." Give me a break. There are only two ways to deal with the exponential increase in P2P bandwidth usage. One is to spend enormous amounts of money and do massive upgrades. The other is to do SOME kind of "throttling", regardless of what you may choose to call it. I'll let you guess which option Comcast and the other cable providers want to go with.
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|I am glad I am not a comcast customer.
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|Something is wrong with the comments on this story...
Half of it is about mortgages and the other half is ???
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|Hmm...
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|By tscar13
posted Apr 16, 2008 - 2:48 PM
Sorry it took so long but I had things to get done.
The site is up and running: www.----------.com
Ihave left the middle blank but I think that those few here with some intelligence can figure out by looking at my comments what goes in there.
First of all, the site is clean-no viruses etc..
Second, there are two formats;
1) Shows information on specific individuals but takes this form
First name, first initial of last name
middle 2 # of SS#
state you live in if the U.S.
Occupation if you work
School if you go to school
OS system
Browsers used. here I found some using more than one
Age- unless under 18
@nd format
Betanews
Source of all revenue streams flowing to the operators of this site.
Source of all revenue for the writers of this site.
So PC laugh but I included your last name and where you work and that also includes Term.
The purpose of this is not to steal info but to prove a point that no OS or Browser is safe and some of you are pretty ignorant of that fact especially Apple and open source fanatics.
As I said before I retired and lived in Alaska and that should give you a clue as to my former occupation. So believe or not believe that is your choice but figuring out the middle part is the 2nd part of your challenge and I think most will fail though in my posts here, the answer is staring you in the face.
Have a dream-like day and, if you want, live in denial. The site will stay up for 1 month and then be taken down. Anyone that breaks the code and proves it here by giving certain info from the site, your name will be removed. Otherwise it stays on the site. :)
Let this be a lesson to everyone that no OS or browser, including my own, is ever completely safe and only an idiot would think otherwise. Any system can be broken into and that is what is sad about our country- We think we are safe but it is fairly easy to brong the country to a standstill because of the stupidity of our leaders. Whether it's terrorists or a country like China or Russia doesn't matter.
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By terminalx
edited Apr 16, 2008 - 4:04 PM
You are an eskimo?
Since you are masking the site, no one is going to care or try to guess...
You havent' provent anything, other then you need to find a life, fast.
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By PC_Tool
edited Apr 16, 2008 - 5:26 PM
*yawn*
Oh, btw... Alaska?
Try google: tscar13 - Indianapolis, Indiana. Football fan, apparently. Was full of himself on that site as well.
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By tscar13
edited Apr 15, 2008 - 8:32 PM
I knew Betanews would act and they have by deleting free speech. Well, I am in the process of setting up a site with all the info on betanews revenue and their writers and pc tool.:)
Delete that betanews. The site should be ready by around 10:00am u.s. time.
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By PC_Tool
posted Apr 16, 2008 - 2:08 PM
1:07 PM CST...
Don't keep us in suspense, man, we're all shaking with anticipation.
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By tscar13
posted Apr 16, 2008 - 5:27 PM
PC? just when I think I've seen the bottom of what an ignorant piece of slob you are, you prove me wrong. The network that I am routing through, the final one is not CST You Dumbsh** and people here actually think you are important. That says a lot.
Since Betanews has some things to hide I have sent to the DOJ the info so sorry Betanews folks, your a** is going to be bending over a lot.
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By PC_Tool
posted Apr 15, 2008 - 11:10 PM
You threatened to hack the site. Be happy they didn't press charges.
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By tscar13
edited Apr 16, 2008 - 5:18 PM
let them.the people I know are higher on the food chain than anyone Betanews knows or you do. So go ahead. be my Guest. And be careful Term and PC, If you keep up with the comments I will do other things with your Info. Take that to your local FBI and see how far you get. They will run into a brick wall. Betanews is to chicken to do anything because they have things to hide and both of you do too.:)
Also I am routing the message through a certain server:)
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By terminalx
edited Apr 15, 2008 - 8:39 PM
You do realize what you are saying in a public forum is illegal, you can't be that stupid...
The same methods you state you can use, they can probably use back at you and might already have.
They are legally allowed, you not so much.
Your comments are personal attacks hence why they were deleted, they could care less at your hacking skills.
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By tscar13
edited Apr 15, 2008 - 9:40 PM
It's interesting all the comments deleted that weren't an attack and one only has to look at PC's comments to see Betanews true intent. And the DOJ will be interested in some of the info on Betanews finances.:)
Sleep well..I've got to get this site up and running.
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By PC_Tool
posted Apr 15, 2008 - 11:16 PM
only has to look at PC's comments to see Betanews true intent
Logic, common sense, discussion, and a sense of humor?
Glad you figured that out. Now if you could only figure out how not to be a victim on the "Greater Internet ****wad Theory".
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/19/
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By tscar13
edited Apr 15, 2008 - 8:39 PM
First the challenge works both ways. Anyone is free to try and compromise my system. Think of this as a test of OS and Browsers. Besides I know people higher up on the food chain than anyone here or at Betanews does so I'm not worried.
The method i am using can't be track and I won't say why. All of you can try and figure it out.
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By terminalx
posted Apr 15, 2008 - 8:44 PM
Right, some super hacker is on a blog site that the rest of the world could care less about...so scary...
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By tscar13
posted Apr 15, 2008 - 9:28 PM
Laughing ..I'm not a super-hacker though I do know some but I also know the vulnerabilities of OS and browsers. I also know ways around systems through my previous occupation. Nothing super just plain old legwork..find the vulnerable area and exploit it..nothing super in that and I also don't use the info for financial gain.
So Term feel secure but tomorrow (u.s. time) your info will be included on the site. I'll will say that I'll only post enough to prove my point about the owners of Betanews and their writers and certain people on this site. Not enough info to be used against you by someone with less scruples than me.
So never think of me as some super hacker just someone smart enough to know where to look and not dumb enough to think that I am invulnerable.:) so I always play it safe and your info along with Pc's is safe.
Betanews is a different case. The time has come to shine a light on where their money comes from and where the writers get their money from and that will be posted and that's not illegal unless Betanews has something to hide.
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By PC_Tool
posted Apr 15, 2008 - 11:20 PM
Can't wait.
I bet I turn out to be a 13 year old girl from conneticut and Term gets to be a 46 yr old loser living in a basement with his Mom.
Oh, wait...we've got those already thanks to El Dingo and zridling.
Really, the worst you could do is *try* to paint us as worse off than those losers. Good luck, I wouldn't wish such a chore on anyone.
Cheers. Enjoy your cry for attention. I'll leave the rest between you and the BN staff (and perhaps their legal counsel?)
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By tscar13
posted Apr 16, 2008 - 6:30 PM
Oh PC you show such ignorance for someone who thinks they're intelligent. Betanews won't do a thing because they and their writers have been receiving money under the table and not reporting it to the IRS. So, instead of them going to the FBI, the IRS and DOJ will be coming for them.
But I dare anyone to go to the police and see how far you get.
PC? you still don't get it.
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|Cool.. So P2P systems will change once again.. How about using port 80 and SSL to do P2P??
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|Pando Networks..never heard of them before..why use a P2P that most of us never even heard of..??
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|"Doing so is in the best interest of everyone involved -- ISPs, P2P companies and consumers."
LoL, are you all love comment like this. Whenever action is taking, by big corporations or the government, it's always doing it for YOU. Like the government's 30 billion handout to JP Morgan to buy Bear Sterns for taking too much risk, yet $0 for Joe Six Packs who get his house foreclosure.
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|"Like the government's 30 billion handout to JP Morgan to buy Bear Sterns for taking too much risk, yet $0 for Joe Six Packs who get his house foreclosure."
Yea...because Joe Six Pack losing his house has a bigger effect on our economy then one of the largest financial firms going closing its doors.
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|but... THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!! :D
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|You mean after Joe Six pack took out an ARM or Balloon loan he couldn't afford and didn't re-fi before the interest went up or the balloon payment came due?
Yeah....poor guy. He might want to consider moving back in with Mom and Dad since he is clearly incapable of managing money.
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|Or was conned into taking because the documentation is too complicated for ordinary mortals to understand.
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|So you are saying that it is alright to for big investment firms to take big risk? If they win, they rip big rewards, if they lost, the government should hand them a check to bail them out?
Big investment firm:
reward = no risk
Every one else:
reward = risk
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|if it's too complicated to understand, why sign it?
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|Lack of alternatives, I imagine. People must have their own house, right? :p
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|Here's an idea, if you're too stupid to understand the intricacies of a mortgage: RENT.
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|*yawn*
What part of "Adjustable Rate" is confusing to you?
Google Balloon payment.
Now try and tell me the information wasn't readily available and that a $100K+ investment isn't worth a google search or two.
Stop pandering to these idiots. Sure, they're victims....of their own stupidity.
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|Yeah whatever... In case you didn't notice the whole US economy is built upon conning the average population. Hence large efforts are made to keep the population dumb, ignorant and unquestioning - which has been very successful over the last 50y or so. Of course at some point the s*** hits the fan...
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|My skepticism can be summed up in two words: "Yeah, right."
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|