RSSComcast to deploy 250 GB/month usage caps in October
By Scott M. Fulton, III | Published August 29, 2008, 11:43 AM
11:43 am EDT August 29, 2008 - In an ongoing discussion with Twitter users, Comcast representative Frank Eliason has said that his company's policy to cap monthly broadband usage (incoming plus outgoing) at 250 GB per month, is actually not new. Rather, he says, the US' largest CATV broadband provider had been warning excessive users before, though it had not explicitly written in its Acceptable Use Policy (AUP) just what level of bandwidth consumption triggered that warning.
"This is not a change," Eliason wrote one user. "It just makes the current policy more understandable. Currently policy is top 1/10 of 1% of users." Later, he advised another user to "search the net for bandwidth meter" if that user was concerned about possible excessive usage.
Technology analyst and former ZDNet blogger George Ou -- who has been following the Comcast throttling debate very closely, and who recently served on a panel on the topic led by FCC Chairman Kevin Martin -- told BetaNews he believes Eliason's assessment to be accurate.
"This new 250 GB policy is not an actual change in policy, but a move to make Comcast more transparent," Ou told BetaNews. "Comcast already had the policy in place but it was undisclosed so users would occasionally get calls or e-mails warning them that they were using too much bandwidth and if they didn't stop, they would be cut off from service. Now this policy simply puts everything out in the clear which is a good thing."
Comcast could still throttle, Ou pointed out, though the algorithm it chooses to use would be one that doesn't conflict with the FCC's recent order. That is, Comcast can't throttle based on which application customers use; in order to be fair, the system must be "protocol-agnostic."
"The new protocol agnostic system will take the top few percentile bandwidth users and throttle them down," he said. "So the 2 percentile who use to consume 50% of the bandwidth under congested times would only be allowed to hog 25% of the bandwidth so that others may have a fair shot at getting bandwidth. P2P applications have the ability to consume 10 to 100 times more bandwidth because of their multi-flow behavior under a congested pipe, so the new system effectively neutralizes this bandwidth cheat."
5:29 pm EDT August 29, 2008 - No longer having throttling as a weapon in its arsenal in the fight to control network overuse, Comcast is now deciding the only way it can implement controls on its network is if it spreads throughput monitoring out to everyone equally.
In an announcement of updates to its Acceptable Use Policy (AUP) document, first spotted by Broadband Reports this morning, Comcast is now saying that, beginning October 1, it will implement measures to cap its residential broadband customers' total data use at 250 GB per month.
As the announcement reads, "250 GB/month is an extremely large amount of data, much more than a typical residential customer uses on a monthly basis. Currently, the median monthly data usage by our residential customers is approximately 2 - 3 GB." If an average movie consumes about 2 GB of data, the text goes on, that would allow for 125 full movie downloads per month. Of course, that wouldn't account for much else.
A preview of the amended version of the company's was stated to have been posted to Comcast's Web site, but was unavailable as of Thursday afternoon. BetaNews has contacted Comcast's spokespersons for comment, which may be forthcoming.
The announcement goes on to say that the service's "top users" will be personally contacted if their usage goes above the 250 GB amount, adding that the company already contacts its bandwidth-heavy users today. However, the announcement did not say that Comcast would refrain from curtailing those users' speeds until after they had been personally contacted.
Last week, Comcast spokesperson Charlie Douglas confirmed to BetaNews that his company would make efforts to comply with the FCC's demand to curtail its practice of throttling customers' use of certain online applications, including P2P, after the Commission found Comcast in violation of its rules on net neutrality. One way Douglas said Comcast would accomplish this would be to implement a new system capable of throttling any broadband user's throughput for as much as 20 minutes at a time, regardless of what application he was using, if that throughput exceeds a certain amount -- which for now is unspecified.
The usage cap is precisely the type and amount that Comcast was expected to implement, by some insiders who were tipped off to the development. Broadband Reports also reported last May that the company was considering implementing an overage fee as well as usage caps, although this morning's announcement from Comcast made no mention of fees.
"we ****ed with your s*** but didnt tell you"
HAHAHAHA... Thats Comcrap for ya!
This is why Comcast will never see a penny from me .
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|I am a rogers customer in Canada and I have their top internet package with a download speed of 10 MB/sec and they recently put a cap in place that makes comcast's seem generous. I am capped at 95 GB/Month and every GB after that cost's $1.50 to a max of $25/ month, so consider yourself lucky if you are allowed 250, the only difference being no limit has been set which would result in termination of service at least not publicly. I personally am facing the reality of having to pay the full 25 every month which make their service rather pricy.
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|Will there be an upload cap?????????
Or will the uploads and downloads be combined?
This really seems like a huge stepback for the internet. There will be no more downloading Hd movies with comcast customers.
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|I am against the idea of ISP putting a cap on data transfer and all. But who the heck uses more than 250gb/month?
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|I am hoping they will consider businesses that use VoIP and Server virtualization to be of a different criteria from that cap. Even small businesses with less then 20 employees could easily hit that cap in a month if they use such features. Noted that this is their Residential policy, However where this goes so to does business changes normally.
Now under net neutrality I'm not sure if Comcast is allowed to differentiate? IDK. It may end up forcing some companies to start looking for a provider that meets their needs and not one that is suggesting to people to not use their network or else.
I know I for one when shopping for an ISP look for advertised unlimited broadband access. All be it privately I only use around 20gb a month. But at my business its normally well over 200gb and at time hitting 300GB a month. Thats just with 6 employees, all using Remote desktop, and VoIP servers, and a few other things used for accounting and project development. So yea... Comcast just would not fit the bill with such caps in place. I'll be interested to see how it plays out. If its breach of contract or something for some customers cause I know for a fact they were advertising UNLIMITED broadband access as late as April in their advertisements. And those required at least 1 year contracts. SOOO... What happens now with those contracts when they change their advertised plan with those customers?
If anything it may lead to false advertising claims with the BBB , cause in their advertising they send out to residence and businesses alike they do not mention the reserve right to change at any time provaso they have in fine print of your contract. So may not be breach of contract, but may be misleading or false advertising practices on their part.
Thought of another aspect that may kill Comcast as a residential provider. Online gaming... Especially in the MMORPG field. If they have members that play religiously I can see that cap being a problem. Especially in games that have lots of updates, or has streaming music and VoIP in them. Just a thought!
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|Thought of another aspect that may kill Comcast as a residential provider. Online gaming... Especially in the MMORPG field. If they have members that play religiously I can see that cap being a problem. Especially in games that have lots of updates, or has streaming music and VoIP in them. Just a thought!
I disagree for the last 3 years I have played WoW with vent leading a guild that raided 5-6 hours a day 7 days a week, the average audio codec is 16knps sometimes 24, usually lower. I dont think it would even be possible to hit 1/10 of the cap with just voip. We used to use 32kbps speex codec but it causes to much ping and message take longer for those with slower connections.
As for games like TF2 and COD4 who use music and or voip I play TF2 stream music and play games online. I know WoW uses like 10-15 kbps down and 3-4 kbps down. Streaming audio is a much higher thing. But if your like me I play my mp3 more often as I can select the song I am on the mood for. I would love if COD4 had it though lol.
So a bit of math based on a 30 day period
Game:
3kbps upload 24/7 (WoW) 7.78 GB
15kbps download 24/7 (Wow) 38.88 GB
VoIP:
16kbps upload 24/7 (Vent) 41.47 GB
16kbps download 24/7 (Vent) 41.47 GB
Average User:
2-3 GB (as stated above)
Music:
64kbps download 24/7 165.88 GB
96kbps download 24/7 248.83 GB
128kbps download 24/7 331.78 GB
160kbps download 24/7 414.72 GB
Now thinking your actually using streaming music 24/7 is highly unlikely.
Excluding music stats 132.6 GB a month 24/7 up and down. I for one know I dont use any of these services 24/7 for a month. At max I was on 16 hours a day. so skipping all the math that comes to 3/4 of 132.6 is 99.45 GB a month. thats under half. Honestly 250 GB a month is a lot for Home Users. Business accounts like the one that my apartment uses has a limit of 12 Terebytes for 250 apartments. Which they give us 1.5 GB a day coming to 45 GB a month (free internet for renters). This is through Bresnan which I believe is leased internet tv and phone through comcast.
Edit: Realizing now music is streamed in KILO BITS PER SECOND NOT BYTES. Not sure on most of the others. 1 bit = 1 kilobyte.
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|I am hoping they will consider businesses that use VoIP and Server virtualization to be of a different criteria from that cap.
I am certain of it. Business customers are given different plans than home users. These are usually dedicated, lines that outside of the normal "bandwidth" grid.
Although I really wouldn't worry too much about it. For businesses, leased lines via the phone company are really the way to go. Less of a hassle, SLA agreements, and dedicated, knowledgeable support...
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|Yeah, I agree.
I used to freelance from home a few years ago, dealing with massive video files (2Gb+) on a daily basis either from my end or from clients (visual effects, computer graphics stuff). At times, I would end up with close to a terabyte of total data transfer in only a week.
Being with Comcast for about 4 years now, If I ever consider doing this again, I couldn't.
I have officially lost my respect for Comcast. It's become another slimy, greedy hog. At the end, the bandwidth taken from existing customers will probably be resold to new customers or existing customers as "upgrade" packages. Just another way to make more money.
And in case Comcast is listening, which likely they are. As soon as this comes into effect, I will be canceling my internet and cable services (I hope other people do, too) and go pay for inconvenience somewhere else as Comcast will no longer be a convenience. Cheers!
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|Maybe you should check your math, I hardly doubt you did anywhere close to a terabyte in a week. I think your off your rocker no offense. We figured out that it would take about 3 days 22 hours to download 250GB, in most locations upload is capped under 100KBps so in order to hit a terabyte in a single week you must have a connection nearly 3 times faster then Comcast offers MAX rate of 15Mbits/s.
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|omg you're genius...(no offense either, btw) It was meant to be an approximate number (you're taking this way too seriously). Even if my "approximation" is not precise to the single byte and I didn't get anywhere close to a terabyte, the fact still remains the same. Some of us for one reason or another in my experience, could easily go WAY over the cap in a single week. Enough said.
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|...and if you *do*, cable is not for you.
A leased line from a phone company would be your best bet.
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|Yea, a LEASED Line. Do you know how much that is? $300 a month for what? 1 - 264Kb line. There is no other alternative for this. All the broadband providers are going to follow Comcast. Timewarner is already doing it somewhere in TEXAS. It's only a matter of time. And I have even seen post from these providers stating that "CELL PHONE COMPANIES" have caps, why can't we. Well, CELL PHONE Companies are now starting to offer "UNLIMITED" plans. Like someone said before while technology moves forward, broad band providers move backwords.
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|FYI, 1bit = 8 bytes not 1 kilobyte. Also for you knowledge, the lower case "b" stands for bit and the upper case "B" stands for byte.
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|1 byte = 8 bits
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|*yawn*
Entitled much?
If you run a business, and need dedicated service, this is what you use.
As for unlimited cell phone plans: Good luck with that. You should really try reading the actual ToS for those services one of these days. :)
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|Good lord who needs 250 GB!!!???
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|I agree
5 gigs is plenty generous but they have to stop the little pirates somewhere so I think this is a "Comcastic" start!
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|Seriously 5 GB is more than anyone should need!!! A bunch of greedy bas****s these days.
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|I concur with your well put diagnosis DR. Just a bunch of greedy little thieves and pirates here.
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|I don't care who your Internet Provider is, if you need more then 250GB of Bandwidth a month, then you REALLY need to go outside!
That Yellow thing is the sky provides light and heat, but don't stare directly into it!
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|Do you work for Comcast or what ?
250GB/month is a silly cap. Anyone with a fast connection uses way more than that just browsing on websites that are nowadays so full of video streaming advertisements in Flash.
Then add how many people go browsing YouTube and similar websites and there you got the common user that needs way more than just 250GB.
And this not counting any P2P activity.
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|No, I actually work for IBM and I have FIOS @ the House!
Dude, 250GB a month is a huge amount of Streaming (Upload or downloaded) data.
If you are hitting that volume on a regular basis, you really need to step away from the PC.
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|Right, because you have to be sitting in front of your computer to download something.
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|So lets see 250 GB is 262,144,000 KB.
There is 2,592,000 seconds in a day.
That comes to 101.14 KB a second 24/7. That's a lot. Now if you stream 500 Kbps for 5 hours a day you would do about 290 GB in a month. Most of time you dont do 500 kbps off youtube. I watched 10 movies averaging 155.21 kbps a second. I only checked ones with the tag showing they had a high quality version in which I used that version. 15 Hours of streaming youtube a day 7 days a week hits 251GB a month. I hardly doubt you watch youtube for 15 hours a day.
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|Here we go again... Per my last posts..
If you were not stealing software, porn, movies and all the other things you are doing illegally you would not use more than 5 gigs tops!! Get a life, try going to work, which will lead to a life outside your mothers house.
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|Do you work for Comcast or what ?
250GB/month is a silly cap. Anyone with a fast connection uses way more than that just browsing on websites that are nowadays so full of video streaming advertisements in Flash.
Are you high?
WoW, Hulu, FanCast, Usenet, Wife working from home..
August: 63GB.
Yeah...just web-browsing will burn it all up in no time...
You really have no idea what you are talking about. Go play in traffic, boy.
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|you're assuming that one user is on the connection. you're argument is very short sighted regardless of that fact. Posing caps can hinder entire entire industries and can be anti competitive. Any easy example of both would be streaming media. By imposing caps comcast could prevent users from using netflix to stream movies and use this advantage to make users pay for their ondemand service. Basic net neutrality thing. You can say that this cap is too large for this to be an issue now but wait till HD streaming becomes big.... or say IF it becomes big since the growth of that market is highly dependent on bandwidth and bandwidth caps. You have to look in the future with you think about this stuff.
"There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home."
- Ken Olson, president, chairman and founder of DEC
"I have travelled the length and breadth of this country and talked with the best people, and I can assure you that data processings is a fad that won't last out the year."
- The editor in charge of business books for Prentice-Hall, 1957
"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers."
- Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943
and now you can join the club
"If you were not stealing software, porn, movies and all the other things you are doing illegally you would not use more than 5 gigs tops!!"
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|per person at this time yes. but consider a family with like 4 kids... Things get interesting then. And what happens if the kids do stuff to break the limit and comcast drops them? These days you pretty much need the net do many things(within reason). That family is gonna have a tougher time. See where this is going?
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|Like some of the previous Posters put, Unless you are downloading Software / Movies / Games and various other things (Illegally) I am sure that you, your Wife and your Kids do not need 250GB of Bandwidth.
To come near it, you would need to download 8.3333333GB a day.
If you are in front of the PC that long or schedule that much information to be downloaded you either need to go outside or you are downloading stuff that maybe you shouldn't.
I doubt your Kids are downloading all that Porn or have their own Netflix accounts.
As a parent, you should be monitoring what your Kids download and how much time they are in front of that PC (AKA: Babysitter). Kids are impressionable and if Mommy and Daddy do it, then it must be OK to do.
Yes, lots of stuff is on the Internet now and it's a great thing, but there is also a thing called "Responsibility" and "Common Sense", alot of people need to start using them together.
And please don't give me the "Are you a parent..." reply, it does not matter weather I do or don't, it's simply Common Sense to be Responsible.
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|1. am not a parent. I was providing an example pure and simple.
2. It is possible to reach this limit, it is actually very easy. Usenet is one example, You can easily download a ton of unlicensed fansubed anime that is technically legal. Daily use probably not but spiked use yes.
Bottom line there are ways to legally do it. Not being able to see all the possibilities yourself doesn't mean you should limit your scope.
I do understand where you are coming from with the rest of your reply and I do agree with some of your logic, but I think it's a bit off topic.
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|Download some Linux distros and/or reinstall EQ2 from the web downloader and you'll hit 5 GB.
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|Who give a s*** what you clowns can get, we have
Tres Hombres", yep ****ing Yanks running our native copperwire network in the lan of OZ, and anything over a DSLAM 'll give you a download speed on 1.6kbs @ max even with the finest provider 60/80gb per month. Thereafter, it's either shaped to dial up speed or 10 cents a meg!
Sorry, forgot the price, if we in the land of OZ want to use bandwith, tis about 4 times the price of what you clowns are paying, you talk about limiting to 250gb, unheard of!
Have a nice day!
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|Thats a hech of a lot better than that 5 gig limit from that other company.
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|frontier DSL. And they are out of their mind.
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|If you guys run a linksys router you can install dd-wrt third party open source firmware on it. This actually has a meter measuring ALL data moving through your connection and breaks it down. It shows usage per day, and total per month.
I can't even imagine what a power user goes through. Online gaming (PS3, PC etc), vonage voip phones, skype, Youtube, youporn. 300mb game patches, if you use steam for getting games. Downloading service packs, windows updates. Now add on top of the daily web surfing, paying bills etc.
I mean holy crap, we use our net connection for everything now. 250gb a month? Is that combined up and down or just down?
I mean even the iphone has a 250mb patch files. Anyone steam their music using itunes or other net radio?
Now add on top of all that, bit torrent, and other p2p programs.
Wowa, I wouldn't want to be an isp in today's age. Especially those guys who saturate their up and down load with a ridiculous number of torrents, that are HUGE on a 24/7 basis.
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|Just a quick comment on the games, I downloaded 'Lord of the Rings Online' last month and the install came to around 15-20 GB. I'm sure it was compressed to a point, but tht is still quite a bit. As for dd-wrt, it is not supported for my Linksys router, or at least not when I looked a couple of months ago. I'll have to look again, I would like a way to track all of my devices.
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|HAd it for a while now.
Excellent firmware upgrade. Highly recommended.
My PS2 isn't online, never has been...even though I got the wally-world special with the built in network thingy. Never saw the point. Only play Burnout on it anyway. ;)
I watch hulu and fancast. I have a Usenet service that allows me 20Gb a month in downloads that I use up every month, may son and I both play WoW, and my wife works out of the home.
August: 63GB.
*shrug*
It'll be a while before I have to worry about that 250MB cap.
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|depending what you use usenet for, you can get up there. I've hit about 280 (not including my roomates usage) one month and it would have been more but that rolled over to the next month. This was actually legal stuff i was getting. I can see users having spikes like this. It would be better if comcast took action if they see consistent high usage, not spikes. Also it should be based off of peak times. sorta like the power company does.
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|My usenet service caps me @ 20GB, in case I am not feeling responsible to police my own usage.
;)
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|Capped usenet though is unusual these days, I pay $11 for unlimited usenet.
I'd have no problems with 250GB myself. Here in the UK, I use Virgin Media which is a cable provider, they don't limit monthly, though do impose limits during peak hours, which is fine by me.
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|The FCC should require any cable company that caps their internet access to open their lines for competition. Right now Comcast and TWC can do anything they want since they monopolize the areas they are in. Verizon FIOS would be a great choice but Verizon doesn't seem in any hurry to go into all but the most profitable neighborhoods.
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|This is it!! I'm moving to Europe!! There you have a better service. Shame on you Comcast!! There should be a lawsuit.
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|This I can live with. I max at probably 60GB a month. That's with myself, my Wife, who works from home, and 3 kids (5 systems total).
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|i hope this cap is driven by the industry and does not end up driving the industry.
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|This just confirms what we all know, that Verizon Fios is the way to go.
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|You got that right. Im sick of waiting for them.
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|I have had FIOS for a month now. 20Mbps Download, 5Mbps upload! NOT A COMPLAINT!
First test was 120MB file. On my DSL took maybe 7 Minutes or so, FIOS... 38 Seconds!
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|If you live in a Verizon area. For the rest of us this isn't an option.
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|Yea anyone thats ever used it would never go back. just as anyone thats ever used a cable or DSL connection would never go back to Dial up.
Thing is the FiOS offerings are still pretty slim unless in MAJOR metropolitan markets. The rest of the country is stuck with DSL and cable for at least another few years. Maybe more.
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|It's pretty invasive stuff form what I understand...
Someone on another forum mentioned something about backup batteries in their garage? Dunno what that's all about, as it's nowhere near my area yet (let alone the next decade)...
Luckily, Comcast offers 50mbit here, so FIOS is a joke, really.
(Yeah, whine about the 250GB cap if you want, but I'd just be happy being able to download the 60GB I do now...faster)
I don't know what it is about you kids today that pushes you to use all available resources, whether you actually *need* them or not. On one hand, you cry about people wasting energy, and the next you demand more than 250GB when most folks get by with under 5.
Oh, and get off my lawn. ;)
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|the battery thing is in case the power goes out so you have phone service. verizon is slowly replacing their copper service. Fios net and tv install is just an excuse for them to do it now. This will probably be done to everyone eventually. Though it would be better if they did it so it's powered outside and not in the house.
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|in case you are wondering. from what I've heard it can take up to a year from the day you see them laying out the ground work till it's actually available in to your house. The rollout team is way ahead of the rest of the company. In my case fios came out in my area last week but they ran all the ground work in my community last fall.
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|I am going to be polite and not address some of Comcast's questionable practices but address the cap. When compared to other ISPs and Cell Phone caps, 250 gb is pretty fair.
Have a nice day:)
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|Optimum Online.. NO CAP. f*ck caps!
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|watch your mouth! if you don't like the cap don't subscribe. Are the sheep too blind to see that? I would set the cap at 5 gigs, so use an extra summers eve to digest that one.
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|and what do suggest the alternative is??? dialup? Their aren't that many choices there, be great if there were and user could do that. But in this case we are sheep on the most part.
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|Everyone contact Senator Specter. He is the guy to handle this!
http://specter.senate.go...ion=Contact.ContactForm
Form is at the bottom of the page.
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|Now with download limits being placed on us, I need a way to track and charge advertisers for the number of bytes they force across my screen.
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|Hi ranJK56,
That's a very smart idea. If you find a way, please let us know.
Thanks
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|Yep ad blocker plugins for browsers are going to be HUGE again.
Block flash ads, block popups, block tabups, block click though, block banner ads, block adsense. What else?? Spam lol yea if anyone finds that solution that works 100% they will be a millionaire.
I'm trying to remeber didnt Fileforums have a Network monitor tool that tracked your bandwidth usage on 1 machine? Maybe they need to make on e that can track it network wide for reporting. Luckily my Cable modem has such a thing built in, but I'm not sure all of them do. You can typically access it similarly to your routers by going to 192.168.100.1 or something similar. Ask your ISP for your Router local IP address for looking at its log files. Thats where mine is. its kinda handy.
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|ad block plus for firefox. but fyi browser traffic is a drop in the bucket so don't bother. It's streaming media(barely right now) and files that you should be looking at.
abp is great regardless
https://addons.mozilla.o...n-US/firefox/addon/1865
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|So I guess that with Comcast now not having to worry about excessive bandwidth killing their network, they will have time to focus on other things and more bandwidth for TV.
So I guess we will see more QAM channels, fewer channels moved from analog to digital, more digital channels...ohhh yeah *sarcasm*.
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|they are getting docsis 3.0 eventually. That may help..........
http://www.dslreports.co...DOCSIS-30-in-2008-89821
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|OK this is just laughable:
(From the press release) "We've listened to feedback from our customers who asked that we provide a specific threshold for data usage and this would help them understand the amount of usage that would qualify as excessive. Today, we're announcing that beginning on October 1, 2008, we will amend our Acceptable Use Policy (AUP) available at http://www.comcast.net/terms/use/ and establish a specific monthly data usage threshold of 250 GB/month per account for all residential customers."
Ahhh, so its not Comcast who wanted this, it was the users. RIIIIIGHT. So the 2% of users who are aware of their excessive bandwidth use and create the problems have asked for a cap. Right, I believe that.
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|*laughs*
You idiots all whine when they cap you.
Oh! they don't have it documented, no-one ever tells us what the cap is! it wouldn't be an issue if the just told us what it was!
...and then they do and it's:
Oh! We never asked for that!
You guys are so amusing...
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|I think most users would prefer to know that there is a specific cap rather than some vague unknown cap. I wouldn't be surprised if Comcast's number are relatively close to reality seeing as one would have to exceed 100KBytes/s 24/7 in a 30 day month to exceed the cap. The 90+% of users that never hit that cap will probably be happier in that they will be less likely to have slow performance when they want to use the Internet.
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|I believe it, I asked comcast long ago when they were gonna cap download speeds, I think a global cap is horrible. I wouldn't mind it capped at 1MB or 2MB with the 64kbps up that my area has. I am tired of internet outages due to people who can't stop downloading and uploading everything they can.
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|If someone could answer this: How much time in minutes or days would it take to download 250 GB at Comcast's standard speed of 6 Mb/sec?
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|Just a little under 4 days...
3 days, 22 hours, 48 minutes, 53 seconds
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|So that means you could use the max bandwidth for 3,2hours each day, or half the max bandwith for 6,4hours each day, or ...
I really cannot understand anyone having a home internet connection (this is for residential access) that needs to use more than 250GB a month. Sincerely... to do what?
What are retarded are the 5GB/month limits on the premise than the median of use is under that cap. Come on!
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|Interesting numbers actually. 8.3GB per day? The only thing I can see using this much would be watching or downloading HDTV over the internet. Amazon downloads are about 800MB for 45 minutes now. Imagine the size they'd be in HD. So really the only way you'd ever touch this cap is if you were an avid TV viewer who decided to get rid of cable.
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|Agreed.
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|I can certainly see a business user using that much but anyone using an internet connection for that much data should have a dedicated line. So long as Comcast make sure they increase the cap as demand increases and technology allows they shouldn't have too much pr issues with this decision. Losing the small minority of customers that regularly exceed the cap won't hurt them.
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|This new "policy" is fine and dandy except that it violates the contract that myself and other customers signed with Comcast to provide unlimited download capacity. Furthermore, Comcast is still signing-up new customers advertising unlimited downloads with no fine print attached. Legally, this policy can only apply to new customers otherwise Comcast will be in breech of contract.
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|I thought it was a monthe to month commitment at most? That you can cancel without penalty any time?
My Comcast is that way. No ongoing contractual obligation.
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|it violates the contract that myself and other customers signed with Comcast to provide unlimited download capacity.
Define unlimited? Speed? Usage? Availability?
Gotta read better than that, my friend. This violates nothing, except your own sense of entitlement.
OTOH: Any advertisement of "unlimited" download would be basically incorrect anyway. All downloads are limited. By your speed, the speed of the uploader, and network congestion.
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|PC_Tool, you're an idiot. As the other words in a contract establish context around an idea (volume/capacity).
"Unlimited download capacity" refers only to the variable of usage capacity. In other words, the absence of a limitation on bandwidth utilization.
The service has a capacity of 6mbps, so the uploading/downloading/non-congestion would not go beyond that. But the metered usage (in aggregate over a defined contractual time) would not have an upper limit, aka unlimited.
You're an idiot for even trying to make that argument. And, yes, it can constitute as a breach of contract should there be no penalty-free exit clause for instances where a significant obligation be amended. Actually, if there is no exit clause in current Comcast contracts, it would be illegal for them to amend the contract unilaterally.
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|On the same token, AFAIK comcast had the right to adjust the terms, especially considering they don't actually contract people to use the service. You pay no penalty if you choose to find a different provider, so the only contract is actually you agreeing to pay for the service as long as you do. It's cable, not a cell phone company.
Also, people honestly don't need that kind of bandwidth unless they are doing some kind of business-level projects, so it won't affect reasonable people anyway. The people who will freak out about this are the ones who would have to curb their streaming self-flagellation activities and file sharing. Boo hoo.
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|*laughs*
"Unlimited download capacity" refers only to the variable of usage capacity.
Saw "unlimited" and mistakenly assumed he was another of the many here who do not understand the concept.
As to the "unlimited download capacity"...
I doubt such a statement actually exists in the contract. It's impossible. They don't own enough pipe to handle that much usage at the speeds they offer.
But hey, call me an idiot some more. It's cute.
If you have that contract, please scan it and post it. You can guarantee that if they promised anything along those lines, they included a loophole.
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|I decided to look at older version of Comcast's terms of service I found on Archive.org from late 2007 which stated "... we have the right to change our Services ... including but not limited to ... speed and upstream and downstream rate limitations." I don't know about earlier versions of the terms and conditions but at least for about a year now they have been clear that they could set restrictions and that a condition of having service was to follow their acceptable use policy. I agree that the original poster probably never had such a contract that guaranteed 'unlimited' bandwidth. ISPs learned from AOLs problems in the late 90s after they went to 'unlimited' rate plans.
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|i think you jumped the gun. tool has a point, it's all in the legal terminology, in plain speak i know what are saying too bad that is not how things work in our legal system. Users can sue but it would be tricky in the courts. Maybe you can prove deceptive advertising sorta like the whole disk drive capacity thing
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|Note to ISPs:
Whoever offers the largest cap with the lowest overage rates (or even better no cap at all) at the highest speeds gets my $50/month. Oh, and if you're a provider also offering cable TV you'll get that money too.
In my area TWC and ATT are fighting for customers as an ISP and cable provider. First to impose caps loses on both counts.
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|Gotta love these caps. With the future looking like everything is going to be online including the OS and Office suites. Also HD Movies becoming more and more popular to download or stream, it will be more easy to reach this cap.
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|That shouldn't be a problem for Comcast so long as their caps keep up with demand. If they increase the cap 50-100% year they shouldn't have very many people hitting into the caps in the near future.
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|exactly, this cap should be driven by industry/market demand and not the other way around.
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|This whole thing has got me wondering how much bandwidth I currently use playing my online games... anyone know if there is a program out there that would be able to tell me this info (out of curiosity as I am not a comcast customer)
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|dumeter
http://www.dumeter.com/
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|Yeah, DU Meter tells me that I'd be shut off already.
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|that's the one I was talking about above. thanks. I thought it was something like that but didn't have it anymore to know.
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|So watching streaming TV episodes like Burn Notice on USA Network, and listening all day to songs off of LAST FM would not put me anywhere near the limit?
If you are a comcast user, is there any where you can look up exactly how much bandwidth you are using, according to their records?
I never really worried about it before, but I do a lot more stuff on the web than I used to.
I watched Olympics coverage on the net, I watch video blogs, listen to music, watch the Jerry Lewis Telethon online too.
I'd sort of like to know how I fit in the big picture of usage stats...
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|I don't believe that the OnDemand content would be included in this, as it's a separate thing from their Internet service. From my friend who works at Comcast, he's saying that the television streaming is actually just part of the digital package, and is wholly separate since you can buy it w/o the Internet, and vice-versa.
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|I think he means streaming video over the Internet. USA network has a website with streaming video as well as many other networks that offer HD programming from their websites. This is not OnDemand. Also makes me wonder about other services, such as netflicks VOD box, XBox Live content, Streaming internet radio receivers, tivo Internet services, Wii online games, and whatever else uses bandwidth that isn't part of your normal computer program.
I'm going to look into the bandwidth programs, but I wonder if there is a way to determine it from the router? Maybe one of the Linksys firmware hacks. I'll have to see.
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|I just streamed 10 minutes of Burn Notice's latest episode, I didnt see a timer for entire video but lets say 25 minutes. I averaged around 230 KBps. You could watch VOD off web sites like this for 7-10 hours a day every day and hit 250 after a month.
Audio is Kbps not KBps, Highest I have ever seen was 192Kbps. So thats 1.5KBps or so over 4 minutes thats a 3.8MB file. not much bandwidth there. Last.FM is 64Kbps to 96Kbps never seen higher. thats less then .55KB a second and .9KB a second.
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|Your math is a little out, 192kb = 24KB, 64kb = 8KB
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|About 53 DVDs a month. Movies or programs at 4.7G.
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|You are assuming that these downloads are done as MPEG-2 which is becoming rare outside distribution on DVD as the processing power to decode more recent codecs has become more affordable and more common. Unless the content is HD most video programs are significantly smaller than 4.7GB. In real world practice I could get a lot more than 53 DVDs worth a video content on 250GB.
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|I really have no problem with this. As long as they are open and above board about it then it is just fair use. People can shop for the internet provider that supplies them with what they need as long as limitations are known. It is the lying, and hidden manipulation/interference that was and is the big problem. Not the limitation.
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|Holy crud. Bad precedent.
But I dont' know how much bandwidth I actually use per month.
So I guess SPEED is not the limiting factor, but Bandwidth?
When I had DSL, you got like 768k down and 128k up or some such thing, and I guess I figured that because of those limits, you could never go over some horrible threshold and get in trouble.
But I guess those fixed DSL speeds don't actually stop you from going over a bandwidth limit, it just may slow down how long it takes you to get over that limit, right?
Oh man...
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|250GB's I would be lucky if I used 5 GB a month :) and I do a lot of webex and demo's from home. As long as they advertise that $33 or $42.95 is for 250 GB of bandwidth I am fine. Don't call it UNLIMITED then.
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|Although this theoretically only affects a small % of their userbase, there *will* be at least one disgruntled user who will scream class-action lawsuit over this. I'm not saying that's right or wrong, simply that it *will* happen.
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|Can't see on what grounds - as long as Comcast offers customers the chance to terminate their contract without any fees. That's usually how it works around here: contract conditions changed by ISP == customer has option to cancel contract without paying termination fees.
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|I wouldn't even move into an area that is supplied by Comcrap.
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|Better then the Rogers 90G/month cap!
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|oh yes. its disgusting that we have to put up with it, the absolute highest tier offers 95GB monthly. Why are we expected to pay comparable rates with a cap less than 40% of what those across the border pay. and then there is the actual speed difference... terrible
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|Where I moved to, we didn't even have copper phone wire.
The new development where we bought our house gives two primary options: Cable and FIOS.
Clearwire won't work in this area yet, so that's not an option. DSL is of course not an option, and Satellite may not be one either, depending on what the homeowners association says you can attach to the outside of your house.
Man, what a hassle. I was really happy with GTE DSL (which became Verizon DSL after they bought up GTE). But sadly, that just ain't an option for me.
Stupid technological advances...
Doh!
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|Your HOA cannot by law prevent you from installing a dish, Period. That a law that was decided long ago. It doesn't matter what the HOA allows, a dish is a given by federal law.
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|I didn't know that. I thought that if every house in your new development was wired for cable, then they could deny dishes or antennas as being a visual nuisance.
I was pretty upset when I found out they did not have to provide copper wire for standard telephone usage.
In our development, you have Comcast or FIOS. That is it. They do not provide for any other telephone connection. We didn't like either of those two options, so we just got me a cell phone.
I called the County just to find out, and they said waivers were given as part of new developments. A bud speculated that it was because the phone company (Verizon) has to share or allow access over their copper lines for other DSL type providers, but by getting a waiver to put in FIOS-only, they are not required to share that with anyone for any reason.
Meh. I don't really like cell phones and don't really like cable internet, but that Verizon FIOS thing is too invasive. Backup batteries wired into my garage and what not? I don't think so...
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|The waiver in your area may be in place for the copper wires. I can't comment on that.
But no HOA or even landlord (if you are renting) can deny you the right to put up an external antenna or dish that is less than 1m in diameter.
You can read some comments on it from the FCC here:
http://www.fcc.gov/mb/facts/otard.html
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|If ISP's plan to create usage caps, they should be obligated to provide FREE tools for users to be able to view their current usage. Imagine if cell phone companies didn't offer any way for users to measure their monthly usage. Even before they deployed a TXT based system, older phones has resettable usage timers that could be used. Right now, I know of no easy way to measure my WAN access accurately for FREE.
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|Yes they can. Its not your property to make that call. But don't take my word for it try and see, have fun trying to use a computer at the y.
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|yup i found out the same when I got DTV at my place since comcast kept pixelating. BTW HOA are most annoying thing ever. They are supposed to work for the community but usually end up turning into thoughtless no common sense draconian monstrosities.....but I digress...
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|they can try to prevent you, but most don't know they cannot legally prevent you. I know people that sued their community cause of this.
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|Right now, I know of no easy way to measure my WAN access accurately for FREE.
Most routers have this information on their status pages.
Otherwise, there *are* free utilities out there to measure your network usage. Search fileforum, I'm sure you'll come up with something.
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