RSSDish, EchoStar sue TiVo to keep their DVR offerings afloat
By Ed Oswald | Published June 2, 2008, 12:16 PM
Dish Network says their new software no longer infringes on TiVo's patents, but the DVR maker disagrees.
Last week, TiVo CEO Tom Rogers said his company believes Dish Network's new software still infringes on its patents, and was asking for an injunction to block DISH from using it immediately. On Friday, EchoStar responded by launching a new suit, essentially asking the court to validate its software as legal and non-infringing.
Such a ruling would give EchoStar and Dish a leg to stand on in the nearly four year old battle between the two companies. Dish Network was spun off from EchoStar on January 1, and now controls all of EchoStar's former satellite television holdings.
"The lawsuit is in response to TiVo's continued public statements that our new DVR software infringes," EchoStar and Dish said in a joint statement. They added that the suit was independent of TiVo's own legal moves.
TiVo's original suit was filed in 2004; and in April 2006 the courts found EchoStar liable for infringement, awarding the DVR maker $73 million. EchoStar appealed the case, although in April of this year an appeals court refused to take the appeal.
The satellite television company has only one major victory under its belt, a stay of the injunction that would have prevented it from offering DVR service. The USPTO has already upheld that TiVo's patents are indeed valid.
If TiVo is successful in getting the newest injunction, it could essentially be game over for Dish. The company would need to either stop offering DVR service to its customers, or sign a licensing agreement with TiVo. The only legal option remaining for Dish should that happen, may be an appeal to have the US Supreme Court hear the case, though the chances of that seem very slim based on the facts of the ongoing legal battle.
"We have not seen EchoStar's filing so we can't comment on it," a TiVo spokesperson told BetaNews. "However, these issues are in front of the District Court in Texas and we remain confident in the outcome."
This is all about GREED. I just want to watch TV.
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|I am a HUGE fan of Dish's DVR service---from the research I did before buying, it's the best bargain in the industry. After having it for almost a year, I'm completely hooked. If they were to be forced to cancel it...damn. If they license with Tivo, I'm afraid the fee will be raised to match Tivo's current fees. I have no idea in regard to the validity of the patent infringement claims, but either way, it's a loss for the consumer. I hope Dish's software is validated.
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|Ok I don't know much about what exactly a TiVo is but I gather it records your tv programs etc. So it would seem to me all Dish and EchoStar have to do is use a proctection system like stuff from Macrovision so that TiVo's recordings would be crappy, scrambled even have a large logo of some sort. Then TiVo would suck at least when used with Dish and EchoStar. I know there are ways around that but not legally. Then you could sell TiVo a license to decrypt/scramble etc.
I know this would be expensive and a pain to roll out, but would it be anymore of a pain then what they are going through now.
Just a thought.
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|I have no idea what you are talking about.
Tivo basically has a patent on "DVR". Meaning that Dish can't sell DVRs to their customer. After all Dish didn't come up with the invention of DVR.
If Tivo wins, Dish will either need to start recording stuff to a DVD/VHS or license "DVR Technology" from Tivo.
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|I have no idea what you are talking about.
Right back at you.
You can't patent an acronym.
The patent in question revolves around the tech used for time-s***ing, which AFAIK, can be implemented in other ways.
Not sure this spells the death of DISH. They'll just have to drop time-s***ing until they can come up with a sufficiently different implementation.
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|Yeah I did not do a good job of expressing what I was thinking.
What I'm thinking is for Dish and EchoStar to do something that would mess up TiVo's ability to record (or whatever it does) shows without a license from Dish, EchoStar then they could exchange licenses.
From what I understand if Dish can't validate their current system then the only other option they have is to get a license with TiVo to continue with DVR technology, I'm sure that will carry a hefty price tag.
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|Wow, you should be a politician. That's quite a devious scenerio you put forth.
Personally, I say give credit where it's due. A huge part of what makes a DVR is time s***ing. If every tom, d*** and harry does it then that's a chunk out of Tivo's bread and butter - as this is what the product is all about, this is a part of what drives people to pay for Tivo 'service.
Tivo invented the DVR - well, they invented it as a standalone box anyway as I'm almost sure i had a tuner with software that could rewind whatever I was watching on my computer, way before Tivo. This is as far as I know on both points, I could be wrong.
So why not just license the technology? Dish Network is huge, they can afford it easily plus, I don't know if this goes for dish customers but as a directv customer, I'm being charged 9.99 a month anyway for having DVR. This isn't for any real 'service' or hardware, this is raw profit being made from having a DirecTV box that can record shows and timeshift what I'm watching. Why not just use Tivo software and give some of that 9 dollars to Tivo and drop this whole thing?
I love Tivo, but I gave it up (somewhat) because I can't stand the interface lag between the Tivo and the DTV DVR Box, plus my DTV is HDTV and I never got around to buying HDTivoDVR. I would love to see it on this DirecTV box though.
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|I agree, Tivos are much better than the crappy DVRs offered from Dish. I am actually hoping that Dish will lose and be forced to license the Tivo patent, atleast then we can get all of the features of Tivo, instead of having to suffer the crappy features of the Dish DVRs.
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|Hmm, I seem to have a contract with Dish that says they will provide DVR service for 18 mos.
If they are forced to stop time s***ing, they are in violation of their contract.
That would not be good for them, 'cuz I'm not a nice guy.
:-D
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|I'm not a nice guy.
Spoken like a true teddy-bear. ;)
I bet you even help old ladies cross the street. :p
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