"EU is a market with antimonopoly rules in place,"not really true :(

becuase they still support monopoly to major companies, i.e. levis jeans has resellerrights in all idividual eu countries.

that means that a shop in sweden isn't allowed to purchase levis jeans from germany where they are so much cheaper. eu has stopped this. so if you have the lots of $$$ and feed the right eu ppl you may go forward.

the irony of this is that i can order levis jeans for myself from germany but then the postage will probably eat of the margin.

i'm from sweden and voted for eu but was told that there weren't going to be any restrictions in purchasing from other eu countries.

another thing why pest windows with mediaplayer
10 etc to play any decent release requires a new
set of codecs which wmp doesn't use anyway.

i rather have a working car set up with a stereo
that i want not a dull one which doesn't play all tapes (windows media player).

"EU is a market with antimonopoly rules in place,"not really true :(

becuase they still support monopoly to major companies, i.e. levis jeans has resellerrights in all idividual eu countries.

that means that a shop in sweden isn't allowed to purchase levis jeans from germany where they are so much cheaper. eu has stopped this. so if you have the lots of $$$ and feed the right eu ppl you may go forward.

the irony of this is that i can order levis jeans for myself from germany but then the postage will probably eat of the margin.

i'm from sweden and voted for eu but was told that there weren't going to be any restrictions in purchasing from other eu countries.

Wingo that example do not qualify as monopoly, the last time I were home in Sweden Levi's was not a jeans brand holding a 80% market share. What you are talking about is paralell import regulations and they apply to any branded product that wish to enforce them.

I thought I would contribute to this but then I thought - I have better things to do. [shrugs]

So does everyone else--never stops me :)

But then you decided you'd take the time to post about how you don't have time to post...that's a contradiction if I ever saw one...

Like it or not I don't think it's up for debate and they need to comply.

Imagine, someone robs a bank and says well I just don't think it's fair that I go to jail for 25 years. How about 5 instead?

Sure, they aren't bank robbers but are they above the law? Nope.

I personally don't think they should have to license code but it's not really up for me to debate since the mandate requires it. It's not really up to Microsoft either. (Let the flames begin)

Good point--flames may begin if directed towards the EU. Sure MS has to comply that's what they are trying to do...

What's the matter with EU people?
Why threat? And why now?

Don't they use Windows too?
Don't they need Windows too?

If they don't want it, why don't they just ban Windows?
If they don't want to ban Windows, then why they don't want it?

Why make things more complicated?
Why stop people for making things much easier?

Why? And Why? But Why?

"Why?"

EU is a market with antimonopoly rules in place, as opposed to U.S., where you can stall evertyhing in court for years and then defy laws through inaction (see MSIE case, see multiple examples of agreesive marketing by Apple and Microsoft, see software patent lawsuits).

Microsoft violates rules of EU, hence they either pay (and keep selling) or withdraw (and lose customers). It's up to Microsoft to make a choice... however stalling is not a tactic EU officials appreciate.

It's that simple. And one more thing:
Personally, I don't really care about MSIE or WMP. I have other, free, stable and much more robust alternatives. I also happen to think, that WMP-free edition of Windows is not a cool idea.

However, laws are laws, and playing around them, just like Microsoft is doing right now, is a big no-no.

Regards,
Ruemere

""EU is a market with antimonopoly rules in place,""

Preposterous. Tell that to the farmers of the developing countries who can't access the European market simply because the EU is blocking them, to the benefits of its own agriculture.
To assume that the EU is some sort of benevolent entity aimed at protecting competition (as opposed - as you put it - to those oh-so Evil United States of A), one has to be amazingly deluded.

""However, laws are laws, and playing around them, just like Microsoft is doing right now, is a big no-no.""

I find all those "the law is the law" types of anal-retentive paternalists to be frankly entertaining. I'm afraid, however, that the problem is a bit more complicated than that: just because it's been called "a law" doesn't mean that it's legitimate. After all, the Soviet Union, Nazi Germany, Vichy's France, Saddam's Iraq or Castro's Cuba have/had a goddam lot of fully, er, "legal" laws of all kind.

Maybe one shall reconsider any "the law is the law" thought before actually writing it...

Regards,
A EU serf

Bloody Hell the EU is full of morons! Once again the EU portrays them selves as bumbling idiots. I say Microsoft should stop selling all of their products in Europe. It would be rather interesting to see what happened.

It would be interesting to see. And maybe 5 yrs ago would have been a more likely option. But if you ask me, it would really help the uptake of linux. Granted this is only really looking at individuals because large companies would be f****d, but it would sway people that way. And once a whole continent started to move, it might have worldwide implications.

But certainly MS should fight back. Why should they give out code if they don't want to! Its stupid.

why should they do something if they dont want to? well for one, becase the government said they have to. They can either choose to comply or face the penalties. Personally, I think rather than always fining microsoft for their misdeeds, I think they should start handingh out prison sentences as well as fines, since 10 years of fining ms hasnt seemed to make any difference in their corporate philosophy.

So since the goverment said you have to does that mean if the goverment told you to cut off your legs you would do it just cause they told you to?

Not trying to start a flame war but why is it that everytime I hear about this it sounds like the European Commission is more or less making direct threats to Microsoft with fines (like that scares them?)?

In a diffrent plane of reality, what if Microsoft just made it illegal to have a valid copy of Windows over seas? People would still use it natrually but that authority would be under-mined completely. Then what would they do? Could take those empty threats else where.

No offense to any country or region, but the EU antitrust commision is full of shît, and needs their heads examined. MS can't just change everything in a few days--my God! It takes months if not years to restructure the entire company. That's practically what MS has to do here. You try changing the way you do business after 12 years of doing it the same way. Speaking of why now? Why not sue ms back in 1992 when media player 2.0 came with Windows 3.1? Arrgghh--this is just retarded. BTW, I was enflamed regardless of your comment, so I started the flame war...

You guys are morons. I think Microsoft should only sell the Enterprise version of XP to the 4 monkeys above because it seems to me they don't want choice.

True! More choices are very usefull,always have an alternative. This problem shoud concern only the people in the EU and what they want, Other people all over the world should mind their own business. The change dosen't affect them... only if you work for microsoft or you own stocks :P

Few days?

"EU's March 2004 judgment"
"Microsoft sent a letter to the commission on April 4"

I assume its "April 4, 2005".

Either way it doesnt sound like they are in a hurry. They just play time, they probably do the same thing with the "next generation OS" as well (Longhorn).

"Oops".

People almost make it sound like "big bad EU politics" are attacking lil ol' Microsoft. This is what happens when you run a monopoly, it attracts peoples attention.

Choice!? You are given a choice, either to buy Windows XP or not. If you don't like the way in which XP is written or works, then don't buy it. It isn't an open source software program and they don't market it that way.

"People almost make it sound like "big bad EU politics" are attacking lil ol' Microsoft. This is what happens when you run a monopoly, it attracts peoples attention."

I wasn't trying to act like that..."Microsoft has accepted 20 out of the EU's 26 demands and said that it will work as quickly as possible to settle the remaining six." Maybe MS wasn't rushing to get all 26 changes. EU, me, you, anybody--I don't believe WE or EU can be the judge of how long it takes for a multi-billion dollar company to change its marketing methods after more than 12 years of doing it one way, then suddenly being forced to change. Maybe you're right and MS is taking their time, but how the heck long do you or anyone else on this planet think that you could change stuff for a multi-billion dollar company? That can't be easy, safe to say. It may just be impossible to implement withen a year of being demanded.

illegal to have a valid copy of Windows over seas? and be left with 5% of the world for customers. playing catch up. great. there's no way microsoft would survive.

Wow, my bad on that one I guess but it would have happened anyway and I can be 99.99% sure of that.

My main question was is where and why does this EU control Microsoft like that? They are not even in the same damn country and they are acting like they know whats best for it? Seriously, I would tell 'em to bugger off. Why can't Microsoft fine them back for all they time they wasted following their demented demands? They got mad even because Microsoft was going to call it "Reduced Media", the whole thing makes me sick with laughter! :)

if eu doesnt want microsoft I think they should be granted their wish.

linux is the future either way. on servers and on desktops soon.

PERIOD.

Maxwolf, do you like having Mediaplayer calling home to Redmond letting them know exactly what you been playing on it?
They did not tell you about that little detail when they got it onto your pc by bundleing it with the OS, did they?

As for most of the other comments in here, sheesh... I can't even be bothered. So I'll follow Dilberts advice "Never argue with the stupid they drag you down to their own level, then beat you with experience"

Ummm...sure whatever you say.

Well, how can Media Player pull off phoning home when I have it blocked from internet access? That and seriously what good would it do Microsoft if they saw that you had been listening too Tina Turner and watching gay pr0n?

1. Why should you have to block it in the first place? And do you think it is a honest business practice to gather your private information without a clear warning that they do so.
2. Below find their explanation for this.

"When playing or copying an audio CD, Windows Media Player attempts to locate information associated with that CD, such as the artist name, title, and track names. This information is added to the overall list of information that is kept in the Media Library. To obtain this information, Windows Media Player sends a unique CD identification number to WindowsMedia.com. No personally identifiable information is obtained or stored during this transaction."

http://www.microsoft.com...#_What_information_does

If you like to trust the last sentence there that is of course up to you, but I take a very sceptical stance to that.