And you fools who think that your FireFox or Opera is better is full of hot air. IE is supported on all web sites, try logging into Pogo or a half dozen other web sites and play their games... they won't work because Fire Fox and a whole slue of other web browsers are not supported. So get off your High Horse and bow to IE.

Most of the sites that FF and other browsers can't access, is usually because of activeX and alike. Many users don't trust these components anyway, so we disbale it, even in IE.

On the other end, as a web developper, I like FF because of the various developer extensions you get. I use LiveHTTP headers and the standard web developer toolbar - something I could not yet find for IE.

The other nice thing I like about Mozilla is XOOL. I am still learning, but it seems that there is a lot of potential, and it seems safer then activeX.

Just my 2c

Cheers

Nice troll attempt. But it's getting tiresome:
http://www.betanews.com/...ser_Launches/1113921171

:o) Just trying to spice up the topic... hehe :o) Makes it more interesting Wink Wink... Nudge Nudge... hehe

You're the fool you sub intelligent human-like creature. Even if IE does crush it's competition you can't see the implications of that? Are you that much of a blinded sheep? I will continue to use and support Firfox (as a currently superior browser to IE anyway) and will continue to use and support it even IE overtakes it in ALL areas including speed, stability, usability, and security (ha that last one was funny).

Get your head out of your backside and start realizing that "what browser is better" isn't the ONLY thing cookin' here!! F M$ Monopoly. I'm forced to use M$ in my work enviroment so let's at least give ourselves a little sanity in that area by NOT having 101% of everything running under that OS "made by M$".

Sub-human creature... Oh can I be a Dragon or something like that? Fire breathing maybe... hehe

You take life to seriously, really it's just a darn Web Browser... Yes I use IE. No I have never encountered a real problem with it. I have been online for over 9 years. Been using computers since 1984. Started in DOS went to Win 3.1 right on up through to todays wonderful world of MS and Mac. And work with computers everyday. Oh yeah... and I am certified in a few of the areas. So I think it's ok for me to assume that it may not be me who is beyond the wrath of this planet. Would that be a safe assumption?

I do enjoy messing around with all the other web browsers, but no matter what it still comes back to IE - my preference. :o)

How dumb is that. You should be using FF because it offers the best options. You're saying you'd continue to us FF even if it was the worst browser out there. I'll definitely use IE7 if it is more improved than FF, but if it isn't I'll continue to use FF.

But I'll use the best browser because I have no misguided loyalty to Microsoft - or Mozilla.

The CSS stuff is good - but...

".....IE7 will receive tabbed browsing capabilities....."

At long frigging last!! It's suprising how something that's "not possible to do" suddenly becomes possible when you're losing market share!

If IE impements the standards and has good tabbed browsing, I'll definitely switch back to IE. I'm not wedded to FF at all - it's just the best at the moment for what it does. If IE7 improves as it needs to, then I'll definitely use it again as my default browser - simple as.

Nay.

I drive a 1990 Honda Civic.
It has few problems and great gas mileage.
But as soon as they fix all of the problems with the new H2, I'm gonna switch.
I'm not wedded to the Honda and as soon as the Hummer supports tabbed browsing and CSS properly-- that's what I'll be driving, baby!

So look the f* out!

Then go get Maxthon or Avant Browser which has tabbed browsing and uses the IE rendering engine.

I've tried them and find them too quirky. I'm interested in seeing what IE7's new security is like. Crazy Browser makes fast use of the IE engine, but I'd just prefer to use IE. If IE7 gives me what FF currently does (tabs and plugins etc), then I'll switch back to IE. [shrugs]

http://www.webstandards.org/act/acid2/

Both latest versions of FF and IE fail this test.

It should be noted that test was created by Opera's CTO.

I'm a big supporter of Opera, but the simple fact is that it doesn't work as well on many Web sites. So are you going to choose the browser that passes some crazy standards test, or one that works well with the Web sites you visit. Standards are important, but you have to be realistic.

If Opera has trouble with a particular site, it is typically the designer's fault: testing with Opera should be routine, and working around Opera's idiosyncracies is far easier than working arounde IE's.

No, standards are *vital*. I also trust open source, and the free software model. I have full confidence FF devs will get us there. The fact that a Opera CTO wrote it has no bearing on the challenge.

I will visit sites that support my browser of choice. Why should I bother with sites that don't? I browse the web with my colors (amber on black, easiest on the eyes), my javascript options,(mostly disabled) my scripts, my plug-ins. The least I expect of my browser is to have standards support. Standards save EVERYONE time in the long run.

My Opera 8.0 didn't even pass that test!

I heard that there would not be a version for Windows 2000 which is kind of strange. Still IE user, I've never had a problem with it - ever.

If memory serves, IE7 will only work on XP SP2 and above, so no Win2k support.

Exactly... but Windows 2000 is not gone to the shelf yet, so why is it not going to be supported for the IE 7?

Technically it SHOULD be going to the "back burner" in June when full mainstream support ends. Keep in mind this will not mean W2k will not have new critical updates but will not have free hotfixes and such, meaning new features also will not be added. I still think they should support it, but look at Win98. Now that they kept supporting directx versions and stuff so many companies it seems just will not upgrade. MS wishes to avoid this with Windows 2000, and I can't blame them entirely. So...is FF and Opera better since they support Windows 98/Me/2000 and IE will not? Well your opinion there. Keep in mind though if MS continues to support IE and directX etc. on old windows versions they will be stuck supporting those legacy versions for many many years. Mozilla and Opera, on the other hand, can even support Windows 3.1 if they wanted with little consequence as they will not support Windows itself. Anybody still listening--if something MS does (or any other software vendor) seems really stupid and pointless, you aren't looking at it from the business perspective. IE7 isn't supported on Windows 2000 for good business reasons, and other vendors DO support them for the same reasons. Now people with Windows 2000 will stick with FF or Opera and MS technical support won't have to support the aging Windows 2000 for the next twenty years. Everyone wins.

You are right, it was an article written by betanews, that stated IE7 was XP SP2 and above only

Yes but I imagine there'll be a hack for people to install it a bare version of XP or XP SP1, I'm sure of it.

Okay, I love FF and I use it mostly over IE. I'm anxious to see what this looks like once they give us something to play with. I figured that MS would break down and implement tabs in the next v of IE, although I remember reading an article where they said they wouldn't. I think its a good move to do so though, else it would be sorely missed by advocates of IE who want to see it up to par with next-gen browsers like FF and Opera.

I'd like to see Microsoft pull this one off. Seriously. As big a fan of Firefox that I am, I would like to see how IE7 fares. Perhaps Microsoft will do something right? Or will they screw it up like they've done with previous IE releases? All I know is that the masses will eat it up as they always do. I want to see IE go down as much as the next guy, but as long as Firefox has a good hold, let IE stay in it's own niche.

Yup, it can keep all of its 85-90% niche, and FireFox's great 10% hold is good too....

Anywho, I couldn't care less about most of the security problems IE, its not my primary browser so it has no effect on me. What I do care about, along with most other web-dev types, is the IE web standards support. If done correctly, no more worrying about fixing my code so that the code is both correct and shows up in IE the right way.

That though is incorrect, as recent FireFox vulnerabilities have been used as "Cross-Browser" exploits to exploit IE bugs through FireFox.

It's about time they made all those changes/fixes. A little late in the race if you ask me. PNG support has been in every newer brower for a while now and Firefox has had partial CSS2 support for a while now too. Even though I am a Firefox'er, I can't wait to see how it looks and stuff.

CSS 2 is mainstream now (it's a standard, not just some draft), and Firefox has had excellent support for it for a long time now. It even has some experimental CSS 3 implemented. IE is the one that's lagging behind in CSS 2. See http://nanobox.chipx86.com/browser_support.php#css for a comparison chart.

Thanx for the clarification :D I think it was CSS3 stuff I was trying in Firefox that wasn't working, not CSS2. Good stuff!

Slight correction, CSS2 is at a Recommendation status not a Standards status. I know its just a semantic difference but W3C's highest level is Recommendation. IETF produces Standards.

Just to clarify, IE 6 currently supports PNG format, just not the "alpha channel support" like IE7 will.

Thanks, I couldn't think of the right word--I just wanted to express that it was indeed an official, final specification.