LOL@windows users getting WGA'd...

you all are realizing just now that Microsux is getting to invasive? ROTFLMAO

First off, I have a legal XP copy, I don't need to keep proving it to anyone, WTF?

WGA is a 'critical update' meaning must be installed, must be spyware.. nuff said on that.

I'd be less inclined to say this if it were an 'optional update'. What is so critical about it?

Anyone know any spyware apps that see it as such? That'll be the guy getting my money...

"WGA is a 'critical update' meaning must be installed, must be spyware.. nuff said on that."

That's some pretty twisted logic you've got there. It does not HAVE to be installed you CAN go unpatched...but why would you. You CAN run your computer without any sort of anti-virus to but why would you? By your logic anti-virus software 'must be installed' thus making anti-virus software all spyware as well.

Just tell me what the criticallity of this update is?

Your ticked because they called it "critical"? Are you serious?

Would it make you feel better if they called it "Needed for other updates" Getting pissy over the semantics of the product is silly, but if you want to play that game I can see how an update allowing you to get other patches for your system could be considered "critical". Without it, s*** breaks...I'd call that pretty critical.

If it is installed by choice, who would actually install it that knows they are using a pirated copy of windows? I doubt there are many people that don't know they are running pirates.

Is good ... but make the OS cheaper ...

Not spyware?
1. A program is installed and runs in the background
2. The program contacts a server daily.
3. The program sends information about the system.
4. If found not genuine the program opens a annoying popup.
5. It's a huge security risk.
So how is WGA not spyware???

I wonder how long it will take before someone modifies WGA on their system and uploads a virus/worm/trojan to M$. ;-) lol

Was actually *reading* the articles too much to ask?

1. Which you agree to before it installs.
2. So do many programs
3. Try reading again, WGA notifications does not send anything, WGA validation DOES but only after you agree to let it.
4. Only people who would find this annoying are those who DONT have genuine software and KNOW it. Forgive me if I don't weep for those who get annoyed while running pirate versions.
5. So is connecting to the internet, WGA is no worse then anything else.

If you have automatic updates enabled, WGN installs as a critical update without any prompt to the user.

but the user made the choice to have auto-updates enabled thus inherently agreeing to the EULA.

Is it really "Implied Consent?"

http://www.groklaw.net/a...story=20060608002958907

it does not automatically install for me and I ahve updates set to automatically download and install. Usually any update that has a EULA that I have to agree to never gets installed. I have seen this on several other computers as well.

Hey ph***o!! NO I did not pay for my copy of XP and you know why? Cuz you did!!!!!! The greed of Micro$oft to have us pay $150 for a copy of Windows is disgusting!! How the heck you think Gates made his billions?? Selling used cars??? NO, it’s called government offices & agencies, businesses, corporations; that’s his cash cows. $20 would be a fair price to pay for Windows. That WGA crap is ridiculous.

"If you have automatic updates enabled"

...which you CHOOSE to do, if you don't choose automatic updates it doesn't happen. and since WGN doesnt SEND anything out to MS anyway...again, not spyware.

Oh...I see. It's the old "I don't agree with the price so it's ok for me to steal it" excuse. Tell me how that works out for you at the gas pump.

"That WGA crap is ridiculous"

I think I might be able to dredge up a single tear for your troubles with pirated software...wait nope, no I can't...have fun!

That is ludacrous. First of all, it costs MS millions to develop and maintain Windows. Do you think it is cheap to pay all of the developers to bring new ideas to the table on how to improve Windows and give consumers what they want? People complain that it took too long for Vista to come out, and maybe it did, maybe it didn't...but one thing is for sure, that they have to sell a lot of licensed copies to make up the cost of development.

Heaven forbid they protect their investment by having a system for authentication. It is called business, and lots of other companies are making lots of products and selling them for profit. If the market wouldn't bear $150 per copy then I'm sure it would be less expensive, and probably have less features.

Programmers bring new ideas to Windows?? What new briliant ideas have they brought? The new stupid, usless, dumbed up interface. Time to get some new programmers.

If you follow the basics of programming you shouldn't have to worry about all the bugs, simply because they cant exist.

Modules people.

"If you follow the basics of programming you shouldn't have to worry about all the bugs, simply because they cant exist."

Thats just assanine. Bugs exist in all software, everywhere. It's the nature of software development. Bugs happen, when they are found they get prioritized and fixed. Bugs 'simply cant exist'...what a crock of s***.

Wow, you obviously know JACK about programming. Error is part of human nature, and you can never make a completely bug-free program, I dont care who you are or claim to be. Learn what you are talking about before replying please.

Yes, it sure is if you enable Automatic updates, that means you allow MS to install anything it deems as critical. Any smart user would set it to prompt before install, you can always deselect/hide it there. You dont need WGA for critical updates anyways,never have

Bugs naturally exist yes, but when you patch the same thing multiple times. It should be once in a blue moon that another one could be found.

For example how many patches have been released for IE? You would have thought that someone might have realized that the way they are programming is flawed. Possibly it would be a good idea to rethink their methodology.

Yes "can't exist" is alittle strong but really, where is their error checking. I've seen Windows return some stupid errors for expected input.

Seriously, you are being narrow-minded here.

Name me one major software or OS that is so stable it does not require periodical patches or updates.

Coming back to the article, I think MS is not being fair to their customers by doing this. I hate them for doing this. But Windows platform is still my preferred platform for a foreseeable future.

Obviously you've never written a line of code in your entire life. You have NO IDEA what the hell you are talking about. There is no magic methodology that is going to make your application bug free, it doesn't happen ESPECIALLY on large projects (in case you missed it, an OS is a LARGE project). No person is omnipresent and can see all aveneus that might get taken in the code. Things get missed, sometimes things in the same area as a previous problem get missed. When that happens the developer fixes the problem. Claiming that MS is somehow inferior because their application has bugs is just plain stupid.

Automatic updates are not enabled by default.

It is something you must *manually* set.

Thus, it was something you *chose* to do.

MS never forced it on you.

You are given the choice to have automatic updates inabled or not. If you do you basically agree to that little part of the EULA that says they reserve the right to update your OS as they see fit.

Hey moron, learn to read between the lines.
GS5’s point was that WGA is just like any spyware program.
Forget about Windows being genuine or not.
He’s talking about the WGA in general.
And it’s spyware no matter how you slice it.

The greed of MS, what are you talking about? MS makes it to the top because it gives customer what they want. If you want to talk about greed, Apple is your target. It sells the most over priced products and not only that, they want to controll everything. They have their own proprietary format that no one else can use.

People use Windows because you can throw anything at it, and it will work. Unlike other OS, the chance is slim. For linux, someone has to write a linux driver, and for Mac, it has to be Mac certified.

Reading is fundamental, go back and try again.

"GS5’s point was that WGA is just like any spyware program"

Which I CLEARLY stated for anyone with half a brain why it ISN'T.

"And it’s spyware no matter how you slice it."

No..it isn't, for exactly the reasons I already spelled out but you managed to skip over in your haste to flame.

Anything else loser?

Well, since I don't personally use any Microsoft products, I don''t really have any concerns. But, it looks like there may be some legal questions to be answered by a court before the entire play is over.

1. Installs and runs in the background: "Norton AV"
2. Contacts a server daily: "Norton AV"
3. Program sends information about the software installed (no, not the system, because WGA notifications does not): "Norton AV"
4. If found not genuine or out of date, opens an annoying popup: "Norton AV"
5. Is a huge security risk: "Norton AV" (through crippling your machine and connecting to the internet to update.... :P)

Damn, I think Norton is spyware. Better uninstall it. Oh s***, you can't! Go get SymNRT - then after that's done, get a tech to hack out everything it left behind. There's another!
6. Can't uninstall program: "Norton AV"

You're a knob. The same applies for any OS - drivers have to be written for Windows too... or do you think they just magically work somehow? :P

Proprietary formats? Ever had a look at MS Office recently? Or perhaps WMA/V? Sheesh.

Here come the one-eyed zealots again.

no, norton is security
the purpose of the company is to protect my computer files
if i didn't want their program sniffing through my files, i wouldn't get it
i didn't hire MS to be a security service for me
i just want an OS from them
but they seem to use one to force you into the other

would be like the company that built my house telling me they MUST patrol the inside of it on a daily basis to ensure their/my security.

Your analogy makes no sense. How is updating your OS with patches forcing you to use a security suite?

"i didn't hire MS to be a security service for me"
...and...they arent, they are asking you to validate your copy of Windows before they let you update it with patches...how is that being a security service?

"would be like the company that built my house telling me they MUST patrol the inside of it on a daily basis to ensure their/my security."

more like, the company who contracted out your home build, requiring proof your the owner before coming to fix a leak in your roof.

" they are asking you to validate your copy of Windows before they let you update it with patches...how is that being a security service?"

did you read your own words?
how isn't it?

"more like, the company who contracted out your home build, requiring proof your the owner before coming to fix a leak in your roof."

you're the one that doesn't do analogy's well

more like, the company who contracted out my home build, requiring proof i'm the owner before telling me how to fix a leak in my roof

MS doesn't install the software for me, i do
i prefer it thet way

"did you read your own words?
how isn't it?"

I read everything just fine, your the one who seems to have a problem with english. Validating you own windows so you can get the patches and updates has nothing to do with scanning your system for spyware/viruses or locking it down with a firewall. It's patching your system for bugs. Some of those bugs *may* be security related, but using your house "analogy" I damn well expect the contractor to come out and fix a problem with my front door if they didn't install it right.

"more like, the company who contracted out my home build, requiring proof i'm the owner before telling me how to fix a leak in my roof"

...yea big difference there relative to the topic at hand...not.

"MS doesn't install the software for me, i do
i prefer it thet way "

Want a cookie? WTF does that have to do with the price of tea in China? You AGREE to let WGA take over or you dont, your choice. The choice alone prohibits the definition of WGA as spyware.

The new WGA not only looks at windows OS but also Microsoft Office this was added with the last update ???????????

can someone explain why i want my computer to phone home to microsoft to check it's license? I purchased my copy of the OS. What is the point of the constant checks; what are they expecting me to do, pirate a copy now that I already own one? Frankly I don't like being treated like a criminal.

MS has a crazy way of showing good will to their paying customers. Think its time I move to Linux.

Dont sit there and threaten to move to linux. No one cares what OS you run. If you want to move to linux, DO IT, dont threaten it because I doubt anyone on this site cares.

Microsoft has a right to protect their product and attempt to stop piracy. If you dont like it, dont install WGA, you can still get updates via automatic updates. Its not like they dont give you a choice.

This clearly shows the power of a lock-in. they are so powerful that they invade your own machine to check whether their rights are protected. and you cannot take a gun and blow them away on your property. It is a "optional conditition" you "agreed" upon.

Great...another loyal disciple of MS...I think the point here is the fact that MS don't need us, they have their cash cows (gov, corps, etc.)

It contacts microsoft to see if there are any updates, when checking for updates it has to know if you are a legit user or a tight a** pirate using a dodgy key. IS this so hard to comprehend ?

No, its called reality my friend. I dont distort my views based on popular stereotypes (I.E., microsoft sucks and does nothing worthwhile). I keep my mind open and objective, not that I can say the same from you and your replies. Linux gets its credit from me where it is due, just like MS, Apple, and any other topic I discuss

In addition to disabling WGA, there are also alternatives to WindowsUpdate.

http://windizupdate.com works in Firefox, Opera, K-Meleon etc, freeing you from requiring IE for essential maintenance (if you do not wish to use Automatic Updates, for example). Also see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WindizUpdate

Also, PeerGuardian is one of the easier methods of ensuring blanket ip ban policies for organisations.. http://peerguardian.sourceforge.net

you do reliaze this can be exploited right??? I mean there is already a test Rootkit that was able to shut down the OS with this tool, so it will not be long before someone incorporates this into a virus...

Well that's not true actually, it just made the OS unusable by invalidating the OS and Making the warning pop up every few seconds instead of every bootup as its ment too...

you can also make a script to redirect the WGA call home features to call a different address thus sending the information to another location maliciously...

Just saying is all... Its 100% possible. Any script kiddy can do this...

"you do reliaze this can be exploited right??? I mean there is already a test Rootkit that was able to shut down the OS with this tool, so it will not be long before someone incorporates this into a virus..."

So....If You can do all of this, why dont you post a link to prove your point? I mean, you started out your reply with a Lie which you admitted, so you lost all credibility right from the start.

What I concern is that, now we have a program on our computer that phones home if we have an Internet connection, and we simply cannot stop it. (Tell me if I can actually stop it.) I am afraid some time in the future it can be used for any data transfers, from simply checking a new setting to sending any information on your PC someone is interested.

I wonder how long before these new features of WGA will be exploited by hackers. I'm already reading on various boards where kiddies want to activate the you have an illegal copy blah blah screen on as many computers as they can.
Can you imagine those who know little about computers, having a legit copy of XP and seeing that screen pop up.

This is why I use Linux

Always good to know. Thanks!

I know people who went into shop X, looked at numerious PC,s, and the helpfull shop people and computer manufactures put nice OS stickers detailing the key for all to see.

A quick windows key change later and .... bingo, updates galore.

people whining about this are simply making excuses for being tight to buy liciences and shouting privacy as an excuse. So there you go, and nice solution for all the intellectuals who couldnt figure it our for themselves.

You are all missing the point/intent of the check.

It simply asks the MS server if it should continue to run.

If there are big problems reported with the WGA tool, MS can tell it to quit running.

Big deal. MS, and every other place you visit gets your IP address, logs it, runs it through analyzers, drops cookies, etc.

Why on Earth would I care?

...

Well, we've yet to hear from PC_Tools
an abject plea that Microsoft is right
however wrong it may be !

You ~don't~ have to be the anti-Microsoft
Taliban to ascertain that Bill Gates & Co.
have far overstepped (again) here.

Even those of us who basically like Microsoft
products can be put off by their invincible
arrogance and insufferable corporporte greed !

If our friend PC_Tool would get his face out
of Bill Gate's lap, he might see this.

...

The Computer Rodent

...

Did I run over your dog or something, jackass?

Is that all you got?

Glad to see you can be mature in a public forum....

...Not.

What if you WANT to be using a counterfeit/pirated copy of windows? Then what does it do to you?

A "fix". As if it wasn't intended behavior in the first place.

My Windows XP Home is legitim. I paid the tribute to all my Microsoft licenses (Windows, Office and Money), now I had to prove everyday to MS that my sistem is not ilegal(or 14 days, and it makes no difference). Microsoft will put your clients beside illegal copies consumers. It's an annoying policy! What will obstruct others companies do the same now? My answer is YES, slowly I'm moving towards Linux. My computer since the sad Windows Millenium has dual boot!

How does it affect you? It runs in the background and checks whenever you do an update. Do you install updates every day?

How exactly does this affect your everyday use? I mean, you've proven that you are legitimate, its not like its broken anyones system yet. Are you experiencing problems because of WGA? Are you not able to use your pc? Please elaborate further how microsoft has hurt you due to WGA

"Please elaborate further how microsoft has hurt you due to WGA"

what does being hurt have to do with anything
it's intrusive without reason
sorta like "guilty until proven innocent"

No, you are not guilty. You have nothing to worry about if you are legit, like most laws in this country. If your copy of XP is legit, running WGA wont matter to you just like if you dont speed, you dont have to worry about being ticketed for it.

No problems when Windows Update checked my computer in each update. No problems for me to check my windows version when I do an update - I think it's normal! But everyday is enough!
Is not a matter of guilty!

With all due respect Metshrine, I think the concern of dejavu and some others is the "principle" of the matter. They know their software is legit and will not get branded as otherwise, but maybe they are annoyed at getting "checked up on" everytime they need updates. To me their displeasure with it is understandable.

Having said that, Microsoft does have a HUGE piracy problem to deal with, so they have to do something in an attempt to curb it. Maybe WGA is not the best method, but that is what is in place for the time being. The benefits of reducing piracy are numerous and well documented, not just to the end user but to the distributers, retailers and developers as well.

Again, how is that affecting your every day productivity? Are you not able to play a game or write a paper because (at most, aiming high) 64KB of info is sent to MS to verify your copy is legit?

yah, but the cops don't come to my house everyday to check my car for signs of speeding
might get a little upset at that :-p

So, it would be ok for the FBI to come into your house every 14 days to check to make sure you are not a terrorist, rummage around in your personal belongings, and as long as they don't disturb you, and leave everything the way they found it, you'd be fine with that?

It's just incredible the amount of pissing and moaning about this thing, and most of the responses are to the tune of "Well that just did it! I'm going to Linux!"

Go then, please. I simply moved to Mac and am happy for doing it. But this isn't the reason why, and not because Microsoft sucks or anything like that. Mac is just plain better (or maybe just more for me) and I still use XP on my development laptop.

Anyway, point is, stop your whining and just go. No one cares if you do, okay?

As far as WGA - why does it bother people so much? Okay, if you're using an illegal copy of XP then you have something to worry about. Fork out the money for a license or use your computer without an internet connection.

Oh, but then theres the hippy types that say somehow their constitutional rights are being infringed on, or perhaps MS is going to somehow do something one day with their knowledge of your IP.

First of all, this has nothing to do with your constitutional rights. Thats to protect you from the government, not a private company.

Secondly, WTF do you think happens when you go to windows update anyway? YOUR IP GETS LOGGED. Yes, this is true. Same thing happens when you go to microsoft.com - IP IS LOGGED FOR TRAFFIC ANALYSIS. So whats the difference between your IP being logged on windowsupdate or your IP being logged by the WGA system when you do the update?

Nothing, unless you're using an illegal copy of XP.

Essentially you are correct. What is disconcerting about it to some is the potential use of WGA. In its current state, it is pretty harmless and there is "no use putting up your umbrella before it rains" as the saying goes, unless we see valid reason to do so.

In all actuality, doesn't the "Windows Product Activation" send out more information than WGA? After all, besides sending your product key info, it also sends a hardware hash of the machine to MS. It is only a number, but headquarters uses it to track hardware changes, upgrades and additions. I'm not sure what the limits are, but there is a point where one can exceed the allowable before their license becomes invalid, though I don't believe that is the case if one has paid the big $$$ for the full version.

I DID go to Linux, it has been my OS of choice for the last five years. However I still have to fire up XP at home about once a week. Also I'm the shop techy where I work and have to deal with 6 XP boxes and 1 Win2K Server there. I cringe everytime I have a WPA "Critical Update" pops up.

On my home machine which is fairly well locked down I got a WPA Genuine Advantage Update a few months ago, wouldn't let me view other "Critical Updates" until I ran it. Well I ran it and it "Failed". I have a legit copy of XP SP2, purchased from a local computer VAR that I've done business with for years.

After an hour and a half of mucking through MS's Knowlegebase I finally got WPA to admit that my box was legit. I had to disable (temporarily you'd better believe) most of my security settings and give Active X full reign over my box to make it happen. SO MUCH FOR PRODUCTIVITY!

Then when I got back to Windows Update to check for anything else "Critical", there was an invitation to install WGA Notifications, which I promptly checked "hide".

I don't need this !@#$%! When I sit at the computer I just want to get done what I set out to do. That's the reason I use Linux all but the hour-ish it takes me to do my bills on Saturday morning. My online financial management software (Mvelopes) recently went to a flash based format that 'requires' Flash 8, latest version for Linux is 7. Otherwise I would only boot the Redmond beast once a month or less.

Microsoft needs to realize that they are alienating their CUSTOMERS. Those running bootleg software probably have scoured the net and found cracks and patches to work around WGA. MS isn't really hurting them. MS is hurting itself!

“…Then when I got back to Windows Update to check for anything else "Critical", there was an invitation to install WGA Notifications, which I promptly checked "hide"…”

Good choice :) That is why I use the “Custom” option for installing updates. It lets you choose exactly what you want to install.

“…Microsoft needs to realize that they are alienating their CUSTOMERS…”

In the big picture, I doubt it. Very few know what is happening; the average person has Automatic Updates enabled along with most of the other default Windows settings and have no idea what WGA is all about. As long as their machine works and they can surf the ‘net, play games and email, they’re happy, blissfully unaware of what is happening in the background.

So, let me get this right, because you had to enable ActiveX for a short time, your productivity went out the window? I fail to see how that works. Please, explain further. I have activex enabled on my freshly purchased WinXP Media Center 2005 copy, and have not been hit by a single ActiveX problem. Nor has WGA negatively affected me. For that matter, I havent been hit by any problems with WGA or ActiveX since WinXP SP2 was launched. So please, explain

Well, I think it is more of the typical whining "Everything that Microsoft does is evil"... Even when it is transparent for users and you won't see anything unless you have an illegal copy of Windows, it is always nice to have somebody to blame for nothing.

I've been using Windows XP since beta stages and never have had any issues with activation, WPA or WGA... and I load lots of apps and beta software in my box. I've been a happy camper since then and don't care if Microsoft checks or not my box for legallity. Stop whining and do something more productive, dudes!

If i'm not mistaken the limits are if you buy a boxed computer with an oem version you can change anything you want exept fot the mother board and the processor because microsoft considers changing those a new computer.

The full version you can change those things but i imagine only a certain number of times before you have to start calling microsoft to explain yourself.

I'm sure betanews had a story about a while ago.

When I say loss of productivity...I mean having to slog through MS Knowledgebase and online forums trying to find a resolution to WGA claiming my legit software was not legit.

I don't trust the known insecurities of Internet Explorer, and don't use it except for the few occassions that I have to get to a site that is 'IE only'. As a result I have it locked down. That's my decision and I believe it a well informed decision. If you've had no problems with Active X or VBS (virus bearing scripts), then I suppose that well and good for you, and your choice. I choose to lockdown IE.

I tried setting the Internet Zone back to defaults, no success. I had dig through MS forums until I found a link to a page (At MS, but not linked to the WGA FAQ's) that told what settings I had to manually allow in order for WGA to authenticate. I found other users with the same problem in those forums. And catty comments from MS moderators that 'perhaps they should purchase legit software'. The fact that the instructions were on the MS website means that they know that there is/was a problem with WGA. The fact that it wasn't readily accessible from the WGA FAQ's page is inexcusable. Catty MS forums moderators shows MS's disregard for their legitimate customers. Having to flush out the fix myself when Windows Update is supposed to be the clearinghouse for XP is shameful.

I had to spend an hour and a half just to find out how to validate my legitimate copy of Windows XP! That is a productivity buster!

Bah .. if u cant setup windows update u must be a real good Techy Gimp.

my problem is that i wish to have the updates, but i dont aggree with the WGA terms and conditions. So "WGA is installed with the consent of the user" is wrong, as you have to install it to get updates...

It cannot be clearer: You were asked to install WGA... it enables the benefits of getting updates from the OS manufacturer. You don't want WGA, then you don't get updates... it's that easy...

Why users running illegal versions of Windows should get the benefit of improvements, updates and patches when they have paid nothing?

WGA is still not a requirement for critical updates, is it? Just the optional ones, right?

Correct. From here:

http://www.microsoft.com...ylang=en#Question5Label

Q."Do security updates require validation?"

A."Security updates are not part of WGA or OGA. You can install security updates using the Windows Automatic Updates feature or download them from the Download Center."

In addition to disabling WGA, there are also alternatives to WindowsUpdate.

http://windizupdate.com works in Firefox, Opera, K-Meleon etc, freeing you from requiring IE for essential maintenance (if you do not wish to use Automatic Updates, for example).

Also, PeerGuardian is one of the easier methods of ensuring blanket ip ban policies for organisations.. http://peerguardian.sourceforge.net

wow thanks for that info, boy it was hard finding the correct link + search to get the bulletins, but yes i got em.

What i disagree with WGA is that yes it sends out a lot of private pc information such as your cpu class id (ie a unique identifier to YOU), and i dont want yet another company with some more information on me. Google has got enough of that...
So i disagree with this. Im the type of person who always tick the box saying 'i do not want to get phone calls or post about your products', and this i feel doesn’t help.

This is the recent trend however - its not a war of tangible resource, its a war on information gathering. Knowledge is power, and i dont want to give that power to a corporate which only has an interest in exploitation and greed.

Is this a little off topic?

WGA sends out a hash of your product ID, nothing more. The IP address is obtained since you have to connect to their server somehow. They dont send out hardware info, in fact, the only hardware info gathered by windows is done during activation and that is a hash of your systems hardware components.

no, sorry to say your wrong there...

if you monitor the packets you will be a bit more sceptical like me... It does send things like file locations also

It does send out your cpu id :)

Post a link to a sample packet capture of these packets and the program you used to capture them. If you make a claim like this, dont do so without posting evidence

What! Microsoft says it is not Spyware so that's OK it's not spyware. So when Dubba said there are WMDs did that make it so because he said it?

No, idiot. They said it's not spyware because,

WGA is installed with the consent of the user

Spyware installs without user consent, and it's purposes are generally malign. The *only* people whi think this update is malign are the pirates.

Hmmmmm.....
I am new to this board, but after reading a few threads notice a quite clear trend. Apparently anyone having anything negative to say about MS can be attacked and called any sort of name whatsoever (along with rude comments)

A quick scan shows that the posters Unhappy about Ms policies (even those making unsubstantiated claims) for the most part are staying polite.

Watching the flow of the discourse and the angry/protective and generally rude/hotile reactions of the "MS guardians" is much more informative of thier characters than of those they disagree with.

Very interesting.

You need a flame-proof suit to participate in this forum :)

lmao..

No, it's only the one's who cannot prove themselves capable of reading the friggin' article.

While I'm sure this won't satisfy anyone who rants and raves about all things Microsoft, my response for the time being is... Fair Enough.

microsoft OWNS YOUR SOUL!!!

give it up for meeeeee!