First of all, and this is the last time I am going to say this... BETANEWS IS WRONG IN THIS ARTICLE... XP SP2 DOES NOT NOW (IN BETA) NOR WILL IT (IN FINAL RELEASE) OFFER A DOWNLOAD MANAGER! GET IT RIGHT! :@

Secondly, to those posting encouragement and advice on HOW to bypass the prevention of installing SP2 to pirated copies... I hope that someday you all get to feel the repurcussions of software piracy. True, MS gets big bucks from multiple avenues, but try for just a moment to care about other individuals besides yourselves who worked hard to give us these products before you go stealing it from them. It's not just about MS, it's about programmers.

Of course there's going to be ways to bypass it, but there's no excuse for promoting thievery.

Aaron
PS- Don't bother flaming my post, I'm done reading this thread, so I won't see it.

Maybe for a week or so...if that.

I do love it. ;-)

.. and I AM still here.. ;-)

fewt!!! Long time, no see. Or are you just lurking under a different guise now? Aitvo?

Not hiding, just using my ORIGINAL nick. ;-)

Suppose you're a pirate who cares about his/her clients' well-being (unlike Microsoft, for example, who don't seem to give a damn, as long as they get the money), what do you do?

Well, simple really: you get a proper VLK keygen (newer ones don't even take so long as the earlier one(s) to come up with valid keys. And yes, not a keylister but a proper generator...) and you take a WinXP CD, pirated, of course, to maintain purity :-). And you integrate SP1 onto it. Then you add the zillion-and-one hotfixes that can be installed at setup time. You also take the slightly-fewer fixes that will *not* install at setup time and put them in as well.

To install *those*, of course, you'll need to use the unattended setup script thingy. So you might as well throw the VLK you got from the generator in there as well (so much better when Windows installs without asking for keys. Reminds one of the good-old-days). There's probably a couple of hundred MBs of space left from an 80 minute CD, by this time, and since you're already using a setup script you might as well fill that up with the latest drivers for the most common hardware in your target market.

Also, since you're a pirate, you might as well pirate some more software: through in a top-notch AV and a firewall. Kaspersky's are nice. Stay away from the Norton bloat-ware.

Finally, you add a registry patch to disable a couple of pesky Windows services that really have no right being enabled in the first place (Messenger, anyone...?).

The final result is a Windows CD that's better than anything Microsoft puts out. Also, one on which SP2 will install gladly. More importantly, one the Windows installed from which will stay on-line long enough for you to actually manage to download SP2 without being blasted off the 'net by the oodles of PCs running pirated copies of Windows and still infested with worms because MS, in their short-sightedness, didn't allow them to be updated.

Of course, if you have proper licenses for Windows, the AV and the firewall it's only that much better...

Who's this ribrsiq WANKER?

i pr3$uM3 $0M3 1337 h@x0r \/\/@Nn@b3 +h@+ $0MiN@+3$ +h3 1337 1@Ngu@g3 = idiot

Oh, so *I*'m the subject right now? I thought it was SP2, really.

How does it go? "It gives me a migraine headache, thinking down to your level", I believe.

Anyway: the point is Microsoft's so-called anti-piracy measures don't hurt or even slightly inconvenience pirates *or* their "clients". They have their key generators, cracks and other tools to get around these measures. Even physical copy protection measures are worked around.

The only people hurt by these measures are Microsoft's legitimate users who will at best be unlikely to be able to get the fixes for their newly-installed Windows' because of all the worms still about and at worst will end up with nice shiny coasters with a cool hologram on them just because Microsoft will no longer activate their Windows' again because they've upgraded their hardware too often for the Vole's taste. I can even almost see the rationale: "If you've spent several thousand dollars on new hardware in the last year, you can surly spare a hundred or two for a new copy of Windows...?".

Here's another scenario: the real pirates, you know, aren't the ones copying the latest Windows for their friend on their 52x CD-RW. The real pirates are the people who make fake copies of software, complete with packaging and holograms, virtually indistinguishable from the real originals.

Assume that you've decided to get Windows XP, hunted about for a bargain, got the cheapest one you could and installed it. Now, you know there's this pain(ful/less) Activation process you have to go through, so what would be your reaction if your newly-installed Windows *didn't* ask you to Activate it?

Depends entirely on you, of course, but a goody-two-shoes user with sufficient free time will take the package and report to the nearest Vole. Which would more than likely crack a pirate ring or two.

So what does John Silver do? Well, simple really: use the same KeyGen, only generate normal activate-able keys instead of VLKs and print *those* on the packages. What this basically means is that there is a very slight probability that there would be, somewhere out there, a legitimate user with a key identical to one of those the pirate uses. Guess what happens when that legit user tries to activate his/her copy of Windows... If the user of the pirated copy runs into trouble, of course, s/he'll just be given another copy of Windows XP (with a diffirent key) and apologized to until s/he thinks Bill Gates will apologize personally, next. Costumer satisfaction is important, you know.

Also, on the OEM packages of Windows and Office (if you've ever seen one), the key is in plain sight protected by only a layer of shrink-wrapping. Very easy to copy it down, if you happen to work in a place that sells them and be the kind of masochist who insists on going through Activation even when pirating.

Now I cannot be sure which of these two cases I've ran into (most probably the later), but there were a few cases of newly-opened copies of Vole software refusing to Activate because they're marked as pirated in Microsoft's databases...

Not a problem?

I've activiated my key too many times so I *have* to ring that BS phone number.

If I wanted to use all the illegal keygens and cracks available I wouldn't have a problem with it, but because I am constantly updating my hardware and preparing vanilla installs almost on a monthly basis I have to suffer?

If their goal was to have legitimate users pissed off at piraters it's working.

Just for the record, SP2 installs fine on a Pirated copy of Win XP Pro. Ran it the first time and worked like a charm, haven't had 1 problem since doing it over a month ago.

:)

They are talking about the Final Version... not the beta.

What really pisses me off about this whole thing, is that i actually BOUGHT a legal copy of windows XP pro, and MS will not let me activate it. Over the pase 6 months i have owned like 4 different computers all with different components (laptops that i was unhappy with), and i went over their limit for activating a new computer. So now they will not let me activate it even if i call them on the phone. This pisses me off heavily as i must either reinstall XP or pirate a copy of software i already own.

what is a person to do eh?

I'm calling BS on that. If you have legitimately installed XP on a computer, activated it, and then completely wiped the machine and sold it, if you explain that over the phone, they will provide you with a new code. You are demonstrating behavior that is consistent with purchasing a single copy and installing it on multiple machines. Of course someone will be suspicious. If you make a big enough deal about it though, and escalate the issue, they'll activate your copy.

They always do activate it - but do you honestly believe I like calling their number each time I install XP? 15 minutes hold.. 10 minutes hold, 20 minutes hold.. There's the BS.

I am calling BS on this. The Activation number that you call has no hold times for Windows XP or 2003. It is an automated system that has a voice activated menu and uses voice recognition for the entry of the PID. The only area that has people on the phone for the clearinghouse is the Terminal Services Licensing area.

In the future, try calling the number before making statements over it.

The specific nature of the activation-by-phone service is dependant on which part of the world you're in, actually.

In the future, VMSBIGOT, try remembering the world is bigger than your backyard.

This is in fact true.

Working in a small computer shop in County Durham, England we have had a fair few number of customers come up to us asking if we can activate their Windows XP Home because they either don't know how to do it, or are scared to do it.

On every occasion we have had to *speak* to someone to get the code activated, something to do with the system not detecting responses properly or something like that we were told, but I would say it's something like 30-35 times we have activated someone's key for them and had to actually to speak to someone to get it done.

Personally, I had to wait 20 minutes to get a activation number for my WinXP copy.

If you end on giving up error stalking the forums, betanews could do with some more beta news.

You will find out different when you install version # 2120.
It locks you out ,even insafe mode.Takes a format and reinstall to get back up.

What possible reason would you have to call the number multiple times on a regular basis? If you are installing a single copy per machine, you'll almost never need to call. Even if you maintain a large cache of machines, you'd have to upgrade something like 4 different things in order to invalidate the key that was already there.

I don't see the reason for people to update their system when they didn't buy it in the first place.
Even if it is to stop bad apple from spreading to good apples, I still think it is not a very profitable to Microsoft to just have a free upgrade for all.

Though I am still quite a bit skpetical about the current scheme against piracy. It is not ultra difficult to change your PID prior to upgrade.

Just like the mention in the article. By preventing the hacked versions from upgrading, will just cause all the Window viruses to *never* get fixed for the people running unlicensed copies. It affects everyone due to the fact of the virus/trojan scanning everyone else on the internet.

But then again I don't even know why Microsoft takes this stance, as no matter what they do, it WILL be hacked again. Its in their best interest to allow the security upgrade.

As for all of us who have paid for our software. I think Microsoft owes us an upgrade cd with the sp2 already installed. Its a real pain installing these sp's because it takes so long to install the service pack seperately each time we re-install windows.

Untrue. People with pirated copies can still patch their system by downloading individual important vunlnerability patches off Microsoft. Though that means you have to download individual patches, it should still be in the same effects as applying SP2. Not all features will be included obviously (such as Windows Firewall, Windows Security Center and IE ActiveX control + Pop-up stopper, and Wireless connection GUI). Other than that, you pretty much can patch the system against online attacks.

not true RedBadger.. you can download the 2-3-400mb servicepack.. unpack it and slipstream it into your current windowsXP installation and burn that to a new bootable cd..wich means that next time you install windows.. it will come with SP2 preinstalled.. you can also do this with individual hotfixes.....

So.. I dont see the problem.. download the servicepack.. slipstream and you never have to run the separate SP2 ever again..just hit www.google.com and search for Windows XP Slipstream .. and there should be tons of hits..they also tell you how to make a bootable cd.. so its just like a WindowsXP SP2 cd u'd get from microsoft.. oh and yea.. this isnt even illegal to do!

I mean , c'mmon dont be upset, this should only worry you if youre a warez monkey. if ppl will find a way to bypass it it? yeah,they will, but again legal users shouldnt worry about this

The fuss is that people though they were going to get something for free entirely without any anti-piracy scheme.
It obviously doesn't concern any users with legal copies. Microsoft is still working on tuning its PID schemes, so it doens't have false-positive effects.

So.. how are they gonna stop people who do this?.. There will just be another keygen out and it seems that most people use the VLK releases anyway and last I looked it said specifically on windowsupdate that it does NOT send any identifying information so..

If microsoft cant check if the version of MS is legal or not how can they decide if you're allowed to install any hotfixes? The main servicepack people will be able to download and slipstream anyway and there will just be a new keygen that makes valid keys anyway.. they could ofcourse change it so that ppl are required to identify themselfs to download hotfixes but that would not only put off pirates but also legal users like me.. bigger chance I'd move to linux at least and pirategroups would just start to release the hotfixes like any other pirated software..

The way it works is that when you go to windows update, an activeX control is sent to your computer. That activeX control then pulls a list of all known updates for all known microsoft OSs (that windows update supports) and then matches what's on your system against what's in the list it just downloaded. Nothing's sent to microsoft, but you still get your patches. In the same list of updates is a list of known pirated keys. Those are also czeched against what's on your computer. A match = no install.

Same with the service packs. It czechs with a list of keys that are stored in a resource inside the installer. No need to even go on the internet to find out that you have a pirated key.

Did you not see what i wrote about KEYGENS?.. Do you know what they are?.. THey are tiny programs that GENERATE NEW SERIALS.. hence It would be a F*ING miracle if Microsoft had a list of the keys in the world that the keygens can generate.. ALSO.. its not very likely that they can make lists of all keys that has ever been sold and put that into the updates as that list is ENORMOUS and grows continuously..

so.. the question remains.. how the HELL are they gonna prevent it?

er, all they need to know is exactly the same thing as the creator of the keygen did - a bit of maths. all they have to do is analyse the keygenerating algorithm, and blacklist any key created by that algorithm.

if there happens to be a keygen that uses the exact same algorithm they're slightly scuppered as they can't blacklist every single key.

I'm not surprised. They will come out with pre-hacked ones like they did with WinXP w/SP1 integrated.

The way service pack two works is as follows, press the WIN KEY + Pause/break to bring up the system properties box.

Look at the registered to section on the main tab, the big ID code on the bottom line here is the interesting part.

The second set of digits will (hopefully) start with a "6"

eg xxxxx-6.... Up to now Microsoft has allowed keygens to install with a PID of between 640 and 690 (i think it is - a bit of googling will pull up the right numbers) Service pack 2 will only accept a PID of xxxxx-640-.... They were going to implement the change in Service Pack 1 but it meant they would have to issue corp customers with new keys and the timescale wasn't possible - so they have delayed it for SP2

however (and I don't condone piracy so this is purely for research) a search on Google for a keygen maker with the correct search terms will pull up a less than 100k keygen maker that doesn't just provide you with a hardcoded serial in a fancy interface - it actually generates a key the old fashioned way.

Like I say for research purposes I ran it to see how long it took - and on my Amd950 Duron, Win Xp Pro SP2 v2096, 256mb DDR it created 10 valid serial numbers in just over 4 hours and 999 keys in total (if someone was to to run this on a dedicated computer for a few days - think of all the perfectly legal keys they could obtain, and more worryingly because they have a PID of xxxxx-640 they can't be classed as invalid keys in a future service pack release.

Because I don't want to condone piracy I WILL NOT provide the search terms I used, but it's really only a matter of time before someone does.

2p Worth

PID's can be changed, new keygens can be made... this does not really matter.

Actually, most pirated versions of Windows XP are MSDN legal copies downloaded by coorporations. These copies need not be registered, because these businesses have a special license that allows them to install any Microsoft software on their network that they buy a "mega-license" for. Why does microsoft do this, since it opens the door to pirated copies?

To answer this question, just imagine being an administrator (or one of many) over a 2,000 computer network. A virus or trojan forces you to reinstall xp pro on almost all 2,000 PC's, and you have to have these computers running or the company loses money. This is what the "special" copy of XP Pro is for. These ARE valid serial numbers, and unless WindowsUpdate gathers data and uploads product keys to its database, not many people will even be affected by this issue, since again most copies have been leaked from coorporations with this special license.

"Like I say for research purposes I ran it to see how long it took - and on my Amd950 Duron, Win Xp Pro SP2 v2096, 256mb DDR it created 10 valid serial numbers in just over 4 hours and 999 keys in total (if someone was to to run this on a dedicated computer for a few days - think of all the perfectly legal keys they could obtain, and more worryingly because they have a PID of xxxxx-640 they can't be classed as invalid keys in a future service pack release."

this is ridiculous, all the winxp keygens out there are total s***, MS knows what they are doing and I am sure lots of people are gonna have a nasty surprise in the next couple of months, trying to install that pack.

I remember trying to generate a 640 pid number for over 3 days, and it never worked. I am sure at least 70% of all pirated copies out there have false pid numbers or use the well known pirated keys which are already blacklisted in the MS database.

The winxp cracks don't work either. I know at least two dozen of people who whine the whole day long that winxp refuses to launch after they updated it, cause obviously the previous cracks don't work any longer. so much for non-corporate versions cracks.

So what's the solution? You either go and buy yourself a legal copy or you find yourself a friend who's working at a big corporation which has got dozens of corporate serials from Microsoft. If you've got such a friend, you can approach him and ask him to give you a serial that has not appeared on the internet so that MS is unaware that it has been pirated and doesn't blacklist it. If you've got such a serial, you download yourself a corporate copy of winxp and activate it with such an largely unknown serial. And while everybody's desperately trying to update their pirated copies, you lean back and watch it all happen with a lenient smile.

of course I am not talking about myself. Me, I went right to the store and bought myself a legal copy of the OS. cause I am a righteous law abiding citizen!

Uhhhh.... Corporate PIDS don't require activation.

BTW, there is a registry key that disables the activation requirement.

Decided to do some research of my own.

Located a 38KB KeyGen that actually allows specification of the PID desired.

Damn fast, too: generated 2484 unique VLKs in *2* minutes! I used a stop watch. Leads me to believe earlier so-called KeyGens must have used a sort-of educated brute-force approach.

Anyway, I hope it's obvious that I didn't actually check all those keys really work, but I did a spot check on a few and they worked OK...

So again I repeat what I've said a few times before on this page: this decision does not hurt pirates. Only legit users will be annoyed by it. Are any Voles reading me...?

Even assuming MS do manage to somehow miraculously block all KeyGens currently out there, how long do you expect it would take for new KeyGens to be written? A few months, at best? In the meantime, there would certainly be a few leaked current corporate keys to tidy people over. In case you didn't know, it's *impossible* for a corporation to control access to its software keys. All that is required is for any employee to run a system information tool (i.e. AIDA32) on a PC to lookup the keys used on it.

incorrect, MSDN copies DO require activiation, and each msdn account is now tied to 10 activations.

There is a knowledge base article that will walk anyone with a pirated copy through how to trick the machine into thinking that there copy is legit. The trick is to obtain an actual legit license key in order to do it. MS released this KB article in hopes of forcing people that had pirated copies to purchase a legit copy and then give them the option to fix their current install with this KB hack versus having to re-install. In reality all they did was give the hacks around the world an easy path to resolve this issue by ust obtaining a legit license from some friend, relative, or coworker and then fix their pirated version.