Yea I have to agree it was an illegal operation and hell you all know I could give a flying fig for Microsoft in general because of how they treat their customers ALL OF THEM as criminals that need to have big brother watching over them at all times, but in this particular case I would side with them. Here is how the "PROJECT" should have been handled... a Mod pack... then and only then would it have been acceptable to MS. But instead they were providing a Full OS competitive package based on their code for free.

the "PROJECT" provided a reverse engineered windows version with no activation, and features from beta testing phases that MS owns rights too. How they got such rights not withstanding... the download they were providing was NOT conditional that you own a real MS vista at all. And that here in was the problem.

If they would have had a Full Mod package, Like a service pack, that you ran after the installation of Vista whatever, then it would not have been a big deal FOR NOW...

Its not illegal YET, for you to modify your installation however you wish for it to be customized for you... I say yet cause I'm sure it would be challenged by MS is someone did a better job then they in the layout and latter they Copied it and sold it as their own. SHOCKER!!!

The truth be told there is already many ways to get key Vista features even in windows XP, without the astronomical and unreasonable pricing structures in VISTA. I mean common Vista is at best a SERVICE PACK upgrade to the OS from XP.

My windows XP has aeroglass features(from the original developer of it), has Sidebar(again original developer), has the equivalent to windows live care(AWC with CP AV), has the new Startmenu system, has the updated control panel menus, and icon sets, has the new explorer layout, has media center edition extensions all on Windows XP pro ... and guess what? Side by side that modified XP Pro is 30% faster then Vista Home premium is on the same system build. I have to give the biggest thanks to the Betanews Fileforum for listing most of those options all this time. If not for here I would not have as great a system as I do now.

You know why? Cause the XP Pro system is missing 89% of the big brother call back and auto disable features built into Vista. But that's another story... I am not a fan of Vista even though I am a idiot that wasted my money for it, I refuse to use it on a live machine. I basically keep it for testing and contract purposes.

Many of us still have the WinFS from the beta build and have used it. there is no reason anyone could not make use of it except for compatibility issues IMO. Just don't go basing a business model around it and claiming it as your own. You are not Microsoft... that's their game. And you do not have millions in hush money to throw at a problem like they do.

OH BTW do a little looking around Dreamscene equivalents does work in windows XP as well. Again original developers continue their work Often after MS steals their ideas and makes them their "EXCLUSIVES" in vista. Just about everything thats in Vista came from an original idea that was used in XP or 2000 first. Animated desktop backgrounds is another one. As well as Video as a Background. Both of which are Ultimate edition features. However both are also available for Windows XP. in most cases for free...

Whatever happened to the moving backgrounds that Vista was supposed to have in its final release?

It's called Dreamscene and is an ultimate extra.

Dremescene is nothing more than a flash movie that plays and is put on repeat.

Actually, it's a lot more complicated than that.

Actually it's quite simple....It's just a flashy gimmick to draw the moths to the flame.

Morons have been doing this for years, making custom versions of Windows and giving them stupid names. Of course they aren't really making anything, they are just pirating old beta or even retail versions, adding custom themes or programs and then calling them Windows Neptune Revived or Windows XP Uber Elite Edition. They're all just a bunch of farktard pirates. It's not a "project", they don't have the source code and don't own what they are working on or have permission to do it so they aren't making anything. They certainly aren't allowed to give it away. I'm all for Microsoft shutting the idiots down.

I get soooo tired of this... it's either ms or linux? there ARE other choices and wouldn't it be nice to see those promoted as well? or - here's a novel idea... instead of the whining about how ms sucks, or about how hard linux is to use for grandma and grandpa, how about some of you brilliant whiners out there get together and remake the wheel - a new os not based off of linux (lord knows there are already enough of those), not based off windows, or any other os? something that's secure, stable, AND user friendly to the pc n00b?

FYI the grandfolks have trouble with Windows, they don't even know what a Linux is.

well they might be able to use "the google" to find out.

refer to original post..

Why bother with that Microsoft crap when you've got a far superior — and proven — OS in GNU/Linux? And as Scotch Moose reminds us, it's free to do anything you want with it.

While I don't blame these people for trying to create what we were promised with Vista, but jeez, it's Microsoft, they fail at everything they try anymore (search, MS-OOXML, Vista, rampant copyright violations, and a gazillion other things). You'd have to be the kind of person who enjoys pepper spray across the eyes to drown in the mud that is Windows code.

"Why bother with that Microsoft crap when you've got a far superior — and proven — OS in GNU/Linux?"

Because the average Windows user is utterly stupid?

let's say "technologically impaired" :)

Yeah, sure.. that's the reason why Linux has pathetic drivers support and no true standard for accessing hardware like the DirectX APIs...

Unlike Windows, however, Linux is built to run on any hardware, old, new, 32, 64, sparc, mac, intel, AMD, you name it. Don't blame GNU/Linux for what any given hardware manufacturer fails to do. Someday soon the numbers will be too big to ignore (there's already twice as many desktop users of GNU/Linux as there are Mac users).

Windows has pathetic driver support... and by pathetic, I mean writing a driver for Windows is headache-inducing, because it needs a whole development environment (the DDK), and using the OS in checked mode. And I'm not even talking about the fact that there are _many_ driver models available for Windows, from the archaic VxD, to the over-complicated WDM, and now WDF that includes KMDF and UMDF (UMDF that is based on COM... yuck).

Linux makes it much more easier, thanks to its more open nature and the use of the standard tools to compile drivers.

I think considering DirectX as a standard is not a good thing, because it's not exactly portable by nature. Maybe it's going to change now, thanks to .NET/Mono.

There are other libraries though, like SDL, made for that use, that can be considered more standard (http://www.libsdl.org/).

So fire up your Linux which has just as many holes as Windows and lets run common business applications that are used in the workforce daily and see where your OS fails to live up to the hype......

Face it, until the Linux gods create something that is compatible.......it's never going to be a mainstream desktop OS.

Show me easy wireless on Linux.......

Drivers are few and far between......

End of your rant.

and that would be the hardware manufacturers fault. Drivers are their job.

So if you have a vision for what you want your computer to do you need to build it on top of Free Software. That is what it is there for.

There is an old saying, "you get what you pay for", and in the case of Linux this generally means a whole lot of frustration, trouble and not much else. But I do look forward to the day, if it ever comes, when it actually works without having to negotiate a rat's nest of obtuse commands just to run a simple application.

Some of us cook. Those that cannot eat hamburgers.

Interesting analogy, which if applied to linux means the three minute egg probably takes fifteen.

if people around the would help
this can be the next big thing
ReactOS
open source "windows" yes, you can run games to!
http://fileforum.betanew...il/ReactOS/1087314074/1
http://www.reactos.com/

I wonder what Apple would think if people tried to make a cute version of OS X or a PC version...... i somehow think results would be the same.

a cute version of OS X? You mean like OpenDarwin? Or you could download OS X ports of popular Unix tools? Like Darwin Ports?

That would never happen...

Anybody thinks the MS era is going to finish and new ones will come in a year or two? Like MAC OSX or some sort of improved linux?

Abd Vakilzadeh

Oh well. This could be a good thing. Lord knows the last thing we need is another Windows floating around.

not that i'm saying i support piracy (i have mixed feelings about it, depending on the case), but i (internally) will always hope to see this being released, BEING THIS CASE that Vista ended up as such a piece of s**t (not without it's improvements and blahblah, but so far from what it could have been).

I'd like to see this done. Don't say it wouldn' be amazing!

They will have to release the source and make it a compile yourself kit.

What else would they sell the next Windows version on?

I can't even remember what WinFS was called when they were trying to hype it as a feature of Windows NT ... Anyone care to remind me?

You mean NTFS? That little filesystem NT/XP/2003/Vista uses which brought an end to the constant random dissipearing of files which all to often happened to be some important system file? I mean it was garenteed to happen everytime you didn't shutdown through the start menu successfully, and it was a hudge headake.

oh, and WinFS is something completely different, perhaps you shouldn't comment about something you know nothing about.

that was most likely a joke moron. maybe you should take your own advice eh?

And a loud "Duh?!?" was heard throughout the vastness of the internet...

It was only a matter of time. I find it highly amusing these folks actually thought they'd get away with it.

For those interested int he "look" of longhorn, there is a theme @ DeviantArt that closely imitates build 4074.

LOL! Exactly.

Can't say I didn't see this coming. Its unfortunate the project is being killed but it had to happen sooner or later.

They were hacking ( yes thats basicly what they were doing ) compiled code. You can't expect that this project was going to ever get to a point past "cool" factor.

The fact they were giving away a product for free, even if it was giving to them for free, means they were stealing from Microsoft.

BIL developers were given Longhorn to "work" and develop their own IP products on. At no time were they saying "here hack this and modify it" I its clear to me.

Anyone that thinks Microsoft is the big bad guy should take a look at what they do, they are only trying to protect their IP.

If the people behind the OS really want to do something helpful, have them develop an OS of their own from Linux. I am sure they have the talent to do so, and if they are not willing to do that, then they were just hacking the OS for no real purpose.

This is not that serious of a breach to me. The code was given to "developers". I think these guys probably qualified as developers. They could have probably handled it differently, but MS should have embraced and examined their work to see if it was worth further consideration.

I agree: MS should embrace the project AND allow it to be sold at at higher price point than say, Vista Ultimate... and split the 'extra profits' w/ the developers.

And not just limit it to that group, but solicit & welcome all comers to all MS products.

um why? its not the developers code.... if they really wanted to work with it, then you know they could apply to microsoft for a job.

This isn't surprising.

Even if this is so called "abandonware" (which it's not), it is still Microsoft's code that they own. Period.

This would be like someone grabbing the code of OSX 10.4 once Apple releases 10.5 and then starting to build a customized OS on that. Apple would squash them in a heart beat as we all know.

It's not even remotely legal.

Epyon_avenger, clearly you have no idea what you are talking about. The code for Longhorn is still owned by Microsoft. That is not up for debate. They would squash a project that was modifying Windows 98 code if someone was dumb enough to do it.

Regardless of what version of Windows is being modified, it is still Microsoft's property that is being stolen and modified.

"This would be like someone grabbing the code of OSX 10.4 once Apple releases 10.5 and then starting to build a customized OS on that. Apple would squash them in a heart beat as we all know."

Not quite. It would be more like building something on Apple Copland ( http://en.wikipedia.org/...pland_(operating_system) ). Abandonware isn't old version of released systems; it's versions of systems that have never seen the light of day.

But yes, your point still stands.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abandonware

In which definition of Abandonware does your 'versions of systems that have never seen the light of day' come in? Every definition of abandonware I've seen has fit with software that, for one reason or another, isn't supported by the original company and has been, for lack of a better term, abandoned. Generally, the term is used to describe software which is not commercially available either, though some time period (generally 5 years) is also applied as well. By this definition, Longhorn would qualify as non-commercially available (you can't go to a store and buy it), but wouldn't qualify under time rulings. However, as Longhorn was (sort of) eventually released as Vista, it doesn't quality under any definition of abandonware, as it'd fall under any of the same rules that apply to its eventual released version. Just because you're pirating a beta version of Halo doesn't mean that Bungie or Microsoft won't come after you...

Actually, yes. My bad.
I just thought of the Amiga and how it is abandonware.

I just didn't quite make it to typing 'Abandonware' into wiki.

Apologies.

(Though if I was a cheeky tosser I would mention that it still isn't a correct example. OSX Tiger wouldn't be abandonware as it would still be supported after the release of Leopard)

guys do you know that wikipedia it's not a reliable source?

I believe you're confusing the term "abandonware" with "vaporware"...

...Don't even get me started; that place has really improved, so I suggest you stop being ignorant.

Anyway, this could have turned out to be a great project, but I agree with others that they could turn their talents to something else such as a linux project, maybe helping with WINE or ReactOS, but it's quite obvious by checking out joejoe that they are M$ fanboys.

That's the one.

Not surprising. When confronted with people that are producing something that Microsoft can't or won't, what do they do? Embrace them? No. Copy them? Sometimes. Attempt to squash them instead of actually listening to the outside world? Definitely. :rolls eyes:

This is not a hard concept to grasp, THE CODE IS MICROSOFT'S IT IS NOT open - source, they NEVER had permission to use it.

For the last time every company borrows from another or buys them out. We live in a world where the fish get eaten by the sharks.

Linux, Mac, Google, any company that is a large company has borrowed and copied as well. Half the Linux distros are setup using a Windows-like GUI. Apple took several concepts from Windows, they improved upon them but still the idea existed with MS first. Ipod, Iphone nothing new about these devices been done before but because its Apple suddenly now its new.