So hold on, let me resummarize. We have thus far:
1. If you don't hate zunes, you're a fanboi
2. If you do hate zunes, you're ignorant
3. If you like some other player, we ignore you
4. If you're pitdingo, you fail at reading comprehension and succeed at exaggeration and flaming
5. If you like iPods, you're a 'blind follower'

Starring: Use of the terms "fanboi", "M$ drone", insults about age.

Anything I missed? Is there some reason to fight over which three-inch piece of plastic and electronics you prefer?

I mean, they still *do* let you choose which one you buy, right?

4. If you're pitdingo, you fail at reading comprehension and succeed at exaggeration and flaming

lmao...

It's not that hating zunes makes you ignorant, or that liking the iPod makes you a fanboy...

It's the pure comedy of someone claiming, with a straight face no less, that sales is equal to quality. Doesn't matter if it's electronics, cars, you name it.

The rest is just bonus material.

Quick Thread summary...

All the M$ drones posting how great the M$ Zune is and how it is the best music player out there, yet it is not selling at all. But that is just because of marketing, not because it is a horrible clone of the iPod.

Ah yes. By your logic Mac OSX is total and complete crap and Windows is the be all end all of OSs.

Quick thread summary of every post you have ever made on BetaNews (and likely elsewhere):

M$ sux! Apple rulez!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1one eleventy! Nothing I say is ever the truth, but I'm going to claim it anyway, because I'm pitdingo, Lord of the Morons!

Quick summary regarding your 'yet it is not selling at all' comment

"A quick check of retailers showed ample stocks of the smaller players, but the 80GB was out of stock"

What, no mention of the Apple fanboy's who've never even touched one claiming to know it's functionality and quality is lacking compared to the iPod?

Talk about posting a one-sided summary...

Thanks once again for providing this forum with a 12 year old's view of the world, now go out and play in the road will you?

Looks to me the 80 gig is selling very well if the shelves are empty so the troll is wrong yet again. Pit$ingo always proves his ignorance.

I noticed the thread about Apple watching is being ignored by the pitdingas.

That is because that story is not true.

http://gizmodo.com/gadge...ion-to-apple-324640.php

sorry. M$ just is six weeks behind on production.

http://www.zunescene.com/zune-80-shortage/

Wishing people will buy the M$ Zune turd, will not make it so.

DANG, harsh...but it is warranted ;)

Wrong like all the crap that you spew here.

Notice he focuses on what is transmitted?

Whereas if this were a Microsoft issue, he'd be more than happy to point out that regardless of what is transmitted the simple fact that they did so without informing the user or getting consent is what the real problem here is.

Anyone who can view the same situation and reach two completely opposing conclusions is either blind (by fanboyism, hate, emotion, etc), or insane.

lol. so the same site which "broke" the story, says the story is really untrue, but you don't believe it?

Dude, your trollsauce is weaksauce indeed.

as you admitted in the iPhone thread, you are wrong and i am right. The id is identical across all iPhones...so it can not be used to track anything.

And also, as i pointed out, all web requests send your MAC Address which can be and is used to track people. that is regardless of the OS/device/platform/etc...

I admitted to being baited by your moronic trolling. Of course, you would take that to mean I thought you were right.

Man, you really are that stupid, aren't you?

You're a hypocrite. Plain and simple. You are as intelligent as your "sales=quality" remarks imply. Clear now?

Moron: The site that "broke" the story was hackint0sh.org.

http://www.hackint0sh.or.../showthread.php?t=16125

Do you always make up "facts" to "win" arguments?

Amazon will only offer that it had shipped a "significant number" of the players

So this means that I should see a actual Zune in use by a person some time in 2008 right?

I'm no Apple fan but i do own 3 iPods and a 3rd or 4th generation iPod touch will probably be iPod number 4 for me.

come over to my house and you'll see 2 zunes.

lol, think about it.
An apple user buys it's products for the need to be noticed, hence will gladly prounce around and let everyone know what they have...not impressed.
Then there are some people who will buy products because they like them, and don't need to let everyone know how cool they are because they have some tech gadget.
Not saying what type is better...just leave it up to you to think which group you fall in nd which you'd want to be in ;)

and some people wish they had a particular product when they settled for a sub-par clone version and then try to justify why their sub-par clone is better when deep down they know they have a turd.

I know exactly what you mean. When i picked up an iPod 30 Gig, i realised i got a sub-par clone of a Creative (since creative owns the patent on the interface, one in which they won in court), so i went back a got a Creative.

Yeah, in my case, my dad bought an iPod and realized that the software was craptacular, so I said, "Dad, Apple is Satan, didn't you see the news about the iPhone spying on users? Let's buy a Zune for everyone in the family." Dad was like, "Sweet, it reminds me of a Mazda commercial! Zune, Zune, Zune!"

Aren't fictitious stories fun!? :)

How'd you know? That's why I returned the iPod Touch and got a Cowon D2 (the D2 was the first to have a touch screen).

I would wager my entire net-worth that you've never even used a Zune, much less done any actual research into the differences of functionality and quality between it and your precious iPod (probably the only Portable Music Player you've ever owned...if you even have an iPod?).

...and yet you still parade around here as if you're some kind of freaking expert on portable music players.

You do realize we're all laughing at you, right?

Creative owns the patent for the UI used in iPod. Zune has a different UI which Microsoft proprietary and has been used in different products (Media Center, Portable Media Center, Zune v1, and now in Zune v2 and Zune software v2)

sure.

#1 the iphone does not spy on people
#2 no one buys the crappy Zune, so i know you did not.

Still laughing...

The problem here is not the Zune. It's the handful of hardcore Apple idiots who hate Microsoft. Even if Microsoft released the best music player ever created, these idiots would come and just keep yelling it's crap. Meanwhile, they're willing to stand in line around the block whenever Apple polishes up an over priced turd and puts an iWhatever logo on it. These Apple zealots are almost as bad as the Sony fans, but not quite.

Summed up nicely... I couldn't put it better myself.

Exactly.

Microsoft would do well to hire a marketing department one of these days.

Hey, if it can be dreamed...

Well, we know M$ could never release the best music player as...it is M$, they don't know how to innovate. M$ is a follower....always has been.

When they can not leverage their illegal desktop monopoly, they fail time and time again. Perhaps if they focused on a non-proprietary, non-platform lock-in, non-DRM laiden, non proprietay protocol, open device, they would be on to something.

It is fascinating to watch your mind at work pit.

BTW good work with replacing the s with $. Very original. It really helps shows that you are not biased or anything.

"Perhaps if they focused on a non-proprietary, non-platform lock-in, non-DRM laiden, non proprietay protocol, open device, they would be on to something."

Just like I can build my own Mac?

Ouch, the stupid, it burns! Have you seen the latest slew of Apple vs PC commercials. They tear Vista and ms a new arse. LMGDAO!!!

Do you apply those arguments to your apple products?
Are you typing that post from a custom built mac?

Hehe a small update!!
I see the blog itself is still as shocking as it was previously.
Any other blogs you post on to try and cheaply plug it?

Have you seen the recent commercials of apple praising vista? no of course not. They have to lower themselves by bashing a competing product but hey it works.

Hey folks:

Does this user ever post anything not insulting or well, childish?

I have yet to see an actual coherent and on-topic post from this user.

Anyone? Mods?

"Perhaps if they focused on a non-proprietary, non-platform lock-in, non-DRM laiden, non proprietay protocol, open device, they would be on to something."

You just described the antithesis of not only the Zune, but your precious iPod as well.

There are already products like this on the market (read: Cowon Iaudio X5L). They have little market share.

Apparently your "logic" fails again. Are you researching flawed logic and simply posting these comments to get some feedback? It's really the only explanation I can come up with that doesn't make you look like a complete moron....

"non-proprietary, non-platform lock-in, (...)non proprietay protocol"

Let's remember a couple of things:
- IPod used to be Mac only for a good time
- Accessory makers have to pay a royalty to use Ipod's connector (which is Apple proprietary)

M$ your creativity shows no limits. For the love of God grow up a little and stop making a fool of your self. Then again most of us find your ignorance amusing.

Newsflash, Zune is worthless. Sales numbers back that up... nuff said.

:::dons Zune Fanboi flame suit:::

Spoken like a true brain dead iPod fanatic. If it's not shiny with an Apple logo on it, IT'S CRAP!

I didnt know the Zune Fanboi flame suit also came with douchebag shoes and a f**ktard hat. The more you know.

You heard it here folks:

Marketshare=quality, worth, and functionality.

According to our friend here, Windows is the most worthwhile, high quality and functional OS *>*>EVER

\sarcasm

You are such an idiot it's almost saddening.

what sales numbers? ITS ONLY BEEN OUT FOR 8 DAYS a******. (censored that last word plz)

LMFAO!

Point, set, and match.

You and pitdingo are now tied as the outright dumbest posters in this thread.

Zune is worthless. Sales numbers back that up

I guess now we'll just have to wait and see which one of you can come up with something even more asinine. I can't imagine how that would be possible, but you two never cease to amaze...

Yep it is totally asinine. And it just so happens to be the truth. People do not buy the M$ Zune...because it _sucks_.

I suppose they could not be buying it because it is the best music player out there, but that just does not make too much sense, now does it?

I bought the Zune a) because I like Microsoft, b) because the specs are superior, c) because I hate Apple, d) because I wanted to drive YOU absolutely insane by demonstrating that you don't, in fact, know anything about reality.

"Yep it is totally asinine. And it just so happens to be the truth. People do not buy the M$ Zune...because it _sucks_."

That must mean Mac's suck too?

hey toolie, since you love your zunie so much, why don't you buy ten thousand of them? you can take them with you when you sign up to serve in iraq and hand them out to fellow soldiers. Then maybe someone/anyone would be using one.

TO THIS DAY I HAVE YET TO SEE ANYONE — ANYONE — CARRYING AND LISTENING TO A zune!! Anyone else?

You would not even admit if you did see someone with one, that much is clear by how much effort you put into your 'discussion' here

Wait... then why are people buying it? Oh by your logic that must be because it doesnt suck. Cool i might go out and get one now.....

Still being a total idiot, I see?

Macs aren't selling well. I guess they suck, hmmm?

How's Linux doing? Not being widely used? It must suck as well.

Your "logic" (using the term loosely) continues to amuse us. It is amazing that one so totally owned by the Apple Marketing Department is so totally blinded to it's use and function.

Comment removed. Parent is obvious troll.

by that logic, does OS X suck too, especially in comparison with Windows?

it's rare, but not totally uncommon.... unless u r under house arrest or something.

There are too many fundamentalists on this site for it to be worth anything much anymore. Think religious conservatives are vociferous, cantankerous, and over-the-top? Tech-fanboys make them look tame.

well its only been out for 8 days so we dont know if they "overestimated" anything .. especially with black friday coming up ... but I will agree ... they shouldved boosted their shipments og zune 80, i was lucky to get the last one from walmart.

Or it could just be they are six weeks behind their production schedule.

http://www.zunescene.com/zune-80-shortage/

No one buys the M$ Zune in any flavor...why would you when you can get the better package in the iPod?

"No one buys the M$ Zune in any flavor...why would you when you can get the better package in the iPod?"

Article after article it's always the same rhetoric from you. You're always wrong, too. Not just "difference of opinion" wrong, but flat-out factually wrong. Give it a rest.

But it's cool to be against the grain.

Yeah GoodThings2Life...a bigger screen, and most iPod owners acknowledge the Zune has better sound. What the Hell was I thinkin' buying one? I've never had a moments regret over my purchase of a Zune 30. I was able to upgrade my old Zune to the features of the new model by updating firmware - something iPod owners don't have the option of doing.

Wrong. Dead Wrong.

iPod owners have had the option to upgrade their older iPods for new features even before the Zune came out! Microsoft "stole" that functionality from Apple you idiot. Do us all a favor and do some research before you look stupid...again.

"...most iPod owners acknowledge the Zune has better sound"

ROFL!!! yeah right. If the Zune is so much better than the iPod, why does the iPod outsell the Zune by such a huge margin?

Hint...the M$ Zune is horrible.

Hows the coverflow on your 5.5G ipod?

How about the new menu system that is on the 6G ipod, how are you enjoying that on your 5.5G ipod?

While were at it, how are the games that you bought for your 5.5G on your 6G? Do they work perfectly without having to re-purchase them on your 6G?

dumba**.

"ROFL!!! yeah right. If the Zune is so much better than the iPod, why does the iPod outsell the Zune by such a huge margin? "

Because Apple spends hundreds of millions of dollars each year to run ads for their iPods non-stop on every channel, beating into your head that you MUST have it. It is the same reason frauds like Kevin Trudeau can sell 10+ million copies of books that promise to cure cancer, asthma, help you lose weight, erase debt, etc. It's just marketing, nothing more. Just because YOU have been brainwashed by the media to believe nothing compares to Apple's iPod, doesn't make it reality.

So is that the reason for it being better than the Zune, because it sells more, and more people have it?

Do you also think windows is better than all other OS's because its used by more people than any other OS out there?

The iPod outsells the Zune (at least, the 30) because all the Zune had was the 30. The iPod sales have always taken into account all models, where the Nano is their top seller, along with the shuffle. The Zune 30 never competed with those, and still did pretty well against the HD based iPod considering this was round one for the Zune.

"If the Zune is so much better than the iPod, why does the iPod outsell the Zune by such a huge margin? "

Linux.

MacOSX.

Betamax

I can list thousands of products that were better than the market leader but never sold worth a damn.

Did you actually think before posting that, or does the Apple Marketing Department channel directly to your fingertips?

Saying it doesn't make it so.

Since you're so keen on research, why not show us some of yours?

Right. Absolutely Right.

That "option" is spelled "$150+ upgrade."

Edit: Moreover, I'm pretty sure that Apple wasn't the first to release a free "service pack" / "feature pack" / well anything involving the word free. I didn't realize, however, that releasing an update was an innovative idea that Microsoft had to "steal" from Microsoft.

iPod has been out a whole lot longer too and has mimicked the AOL marketing strategy... throw it in customer's faces fast and furious and require them all to use it or nothing by having exclusive deals with content providers.

Zune hasn't done that... yet. But thanks for proving the same point another poster above has mentioned:

High Selling = Best. Product. EVAR! Thus proving once and for all that Windows is the best OS ever.

F'ing tard.

I cannot honestly believe that there is a single regular user on this forum that actually reads your posts out of anything other than morbid curiosity. Seriously, not a one.

We see the "By pitdingo" line and wonder, "What wondrously stupid BS is he going to come up with this time that is effectively the direct opposite of reality?"

Well, you've done a bang-up job on this one genius.

If the Zune is so much better than the iPod, why does the iPod outsell the Zune by such a huge margin?

One simply cannot help but laugh at you.

"ROFL!!! yeah right. If the Zune is so much better than the iPod, why does the iPod outsell the Zune by such a huge margin?"

I'm no fan of the zune but I can see thats a pretty ****en stupid comment.. might want to edit that?

"why does the iPod outsell the Zune by such a huge margin?"

It is really quite simple. It can be described in 1 word actually: Marketing

The problem is that most people have never even heard of a Zune, much less know what it is capable of. But anyway continue with your fantasy that your beloved iPod is "oh so superior."

Ah yes I just saw a comment below "Do you also think windows is better than all other OS's because its used by more people than any other OS out there?" So by your logic I guess that means that Macs aren't even worth mopping the floor with because their sales are abysmal compared to PCs.

Sucks having your own logic kicked back in your face don't it.

Actually, wrong wrong wrong again!

Woot sold about 35,000 Zunes (in the past 3 weeks)
people like the Zune and with the new update the wireless sync is really nice, is there bugs in it? Yes, but the Zune 2 was completely redone its a MS product this time instead of a rebadged toshiba.

The software is a lot more appealing, works better but there are bugs with the metadata which I am sure will be worked out (its taken ipod what 10-15 versions of Itunes and it still has issues?)

Also it is marketing, if there was a marketing campaign like Ipod more people would buy it, I had several co-workers come up to me today and liked what they saw and were considering an Ipod but saw my Zune and liked what they saw.

See some people actually USE the product and TRY it before going "oh MS made it it has to be crap" mentality.

Well... at least I can say I've been there: I used an iPod for a year, then switched to a Zune v1 (which now has a year) and I'm loving the change. My Zune could not be shiny and thin, but it does the job way better than my iPod video. UI is easier to use and I can actually watch movies at a decent size (not like watching a widescreen movie bought from iTunes on the tiny iPod's screen).

Having being an iPod and Zune user I can say, without a doubt, I'm not switching back to an iPod.

Ah so Apple invented upgrades what crap.

"...ROFL!!! yeah right. If the Zune is so much better than the iPod, why does the iPod outsell the Zune by such a huge margin?"

Ah skip it. I just can't top all of the existing rebuttals. LOL Seriously. The Zune *is* a quality product. Try it Pit - you'll like it. :-)

"By Program86 - "Wrong. Dead Wrong..."

Really?
Do *yourself* a favor and read this, you dolt:

http://gizmodo.com/gadge...ur-customers-306422.php
Now go off somewhere and choke on an apple.

when MS was selling Zune and acknowleding it's HD based player may not be as attractive as flash...the consumers showed everyone otherwise. HD based media units aren't all that bad ;)

my wife got my zune 80 from Circuit City Friday. i can't play with until dec 7th (my b-day). i have the zune 30 for now. i am really loving the podcast. i am very addicted to the podcast. i listen to music about 20% of time since november 13th. very well done microsoft. I will be keeping my zune 30 for work and the zune 80 for home/play.

I hope to check out some podcasts this weekend, but I am very disappointed by News & Politics selection. Hopefully the Tech News section will be better until I can email Savage, Limbaugh, Beck, and Hannity to signup their podcasts on the service. :)

I find this story interesting. It may be the first concrete evidence of there being different "markets" of music listeners.

for example, it's possible that "users who keep huge libraries of music, prefer the features of the Zune".

^This^

It could be an important way of channelling the markets if this is the case.

It could actually come down to having different features in different capacity music players.

Or it could just be that Microsoft ****ed up.

Indeed... the Zune's screen is larger and crisper than the iPod's display, and 80GB is a lot of space for not just music, but video as well. Since the new Zune can take video recorded via Media Center, that makes it very attractive for video enthusiasts.

It's obvious that MS ****ed up here by basing their sales predictions on iPod sales trends. The average Zune customer is COMPLETEY different than the average iPod customer. You'd think they would know that...

I don't have a Zune, but I love my Windows Media Center. MCE is one of the coolest apps ever. Are you saying I can sync my MCE content to a Zune? Is it just video or I can I make MCE my sync master for videos/music/photos/etc..

Its just for recorded TV, mainly. If any of the videos you have are in your Zune library (ie. referenced in the actual program), and they are a type that can be converted into WMV, then you can sync those as well, along with all your music and photos.

Recorded TV connectivity is extremely convenient.

Indeed.

Yes, iPod users are blind followers of whatever Apple says is the right product to get.

Zune users have very demanding expectations... just look at the Zune support forums to see how vehement they are about getting some new features in the Zune software.

Not all iPod users are blind followers of apple. Yes sure the ones on this board may be but outside that….
iPod is the name you hear and see when you go shopping. It could be a piece of s*** compared to something else but that’s where the marketing is clever in telling people what they need.
People with zunes are more likely to be more technically aware people as they don’t have marketing shoved down their throats yet. It’s those features they see on the zune that’s appealing.

How is that not "blind" following? Being a blind follower implies that what you don't see is reality, not that you don't see something thrown in your face all the time.

It's not a bad product, they just dont see alternatives. Theres only the one thing to look at. You say zen they say 'what?'
You say zune they say 'what?'

Blind following is the people that post on here knowing there is a better product, well informed but decide to keep bashing everything thats against theirs

First of all, I know what a Zen is. I considered them prior to the Zune's release. I know several friends who have them and like them.

I chose based on my needs as a consumer. There is nothing blind about that.

Finally, you have the right definition, but you still seem to be applying it incorrectly.

Hehe I am not applying my definition to your buying habits dont get me wrong :)