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Microsoft May Pull Windows from Korea

By Nate Mook, BetaNews

October 28, 2005, 11:09 AM

In its quarterly filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission, Microsoft made an interesting disclosure about an ongoing investigation by the Korean antitrust agency: it may delay future versions of Windows in South Korea or pull the operating system from the country altogether.

The Korean Fair Trade Commission (KFTC) is looking into allegations that Microsoft violated antitrust laws by bundling services such as streaming media and instant messaging. The complaints first came from Korea's Internet portal Daum Communications and later by RealNetworks.

"It might be necessary to withdraw Windows from the Korean market or delay offering new versions in Korea," Microsoft wrote in the filing. The company previously said the KFTC's claims were without merit, but it would cooperate fully.

Earlier this month, Microsoft settled its long-standing antitrust battle with RealNetworks in a blockbuster $761 million deal, which included marketing promotion for Real and access to internal Windows APIs.

Although Real dropped its complaints in the US and European Union following the settlement, the KFTC says it will continue its investigation unabated. Microsoft acknowledged that South Korea could ask the company to remove portions of the operating system or create a version specific for the country.

Microsoft has already been forced by the European Union to create a special version of Windows for EU computer makers that strips out Windows Media Player. However, demand for the special release has been minimal, according to reports.

Jupiter Research senior analyst Joe Wilcox suggested Microsoft could be trying to send regulators a message.

"According to SEC filings, about two thirds of Microsoft revenue comes from the US. Much of the rest from Europe," Wilcox explained. "While Korea is an important market, given huge broadband penetration there and the influence of companies like Samsung, it's not necessarily all that materially important to Microsoft."

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By pafinator11

posted Oct 29, 2005 - 9:12 AM

I hate microsoft, i hate bill gates, but... I think this is 100% BS! It's Microsoft's product! They can bundle whatever they want in it, however they want to. YOU have the RIGHT not to purchase Windows! I use linux and live happily. If I was Microsoft, I would have used my money and started a war against these countries by now!

Score: 0

By eclipsingdivinity

posted Oct 29, 2005 - 2:22 PM

If you don't like Windows Media Player, don't use it. If you don't like MSN messenger dont use it. It's a pretty simple concept really. I don't think Microsoft is breaking any antitrust laws by providing n00b services to home users who may not know a whole lot about what an operating system has to offer. In honesty, Microsoft's pre-installed services such as MSN messenger and Media Player give people a taste of what's 'out there' on the internet for download. I use Windows Media Player, it's a great program. MSN Messenger...better than AIM any day.

Score: 0

By JacenSolo

edited Oct 30, 2005 - 1:59 AM

PLus. Most of these are from PAID competitors. Who wants to pay for a media player? Not me.

Real's ads count as a payment/

Score: 0

By turbo_nissan_racer

posted Oct 29, 2005 - 7:34 AM

Jews did it

Score: 0

By kompressive

edited Oct 29, 2005 - 1:11 AM

It's a damn free global market out there. If MS pulls out then oh freakin well...So they loose a few dollars here and there. Better than loosing a crap load of dollars customizing a mass produced product just because a small country doesn't like what's offered. And it's really the politicians who try to speak for the people when the people might actually be saying something else or nothing at all. Maybe the people like Windows the way it is but the politicians take it upon themselves to misrepresent their citizens in their own image and therefore screw the whole process of the market. In the end it's the consumers that suffer so if the Korean gov't wants to play chicken with MS then go ahead. Make their day. You will not see MS shedding any tears. The world won't even stop turning for one country, much less one person.

Score: 0

By jerrico

posted Oct 30, 2005 - 12:27 PM

It's a damn free global market out there
I feel the same way about Mass choosing Open Office over ms office.Im just kicken back watching ms sheading tears and trying to buy people off, claiming the decision unfair.lol damn free will

Score: 0

By crashoverride

posted Oct 29, 2005 - 12:36 AM

What makes the Koreans so special. We get forcefed Windows messenger and Media player and nothing has been done about it. Why should they get treated any better.

Score: 0

By jerrico

posted Oct 31, 2005 - 12:03 PM

Because unlike you they are not just going to bend over and look back with a smile.

Score: 0

By crashoverride

posted Oct 31, 2005 - 2:07 PM

Who's bending over, just because it's there doesn't mean I use it. I just don't like the fact that the garbage is even there. It's one reason I've started looking at alternatives.

Score: 0

By JacenSolo

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 8:08 PM

I've said it before and I'll say it again. It's Microsoft product, they can do what they like. This Anti-Trust thing is bull****

Score: 0

By gawd21

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 8:58 PM

I agree.

Score: 0

By azimov

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 4:37 PM

Do the Korean care ?

Score: 0

By jerrico

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 3:48 PM

I cut and pasted this one, owell here yall go anyways
Multiple Convicted Felon Microsoft is, again, under investigation in Japan, Korea, China, France, Germany, and several other nations.

The problems in Asia, for anyone using Microsoft products is the loss of 'Face', and the perceived lack of ethics and integrity, in dealing with a convicted felon. Using a product that is 8X slower than the freely available and very competent 400+ alternatives, that also are more secure, is seen as foolhardy by the Asians, just as much as by the rest of the world.

Microsoft.com runs 15,000 Akamai Linux servers.
Hotmail.com runs 14,000 BSD and Linux servers.
Yahoo.com runs on FreeBSD servers. Google runs on Linux clusters. Almost every Fortune 500 corporation, and 168 world governments, mandate the use of IEEE POSIX OSes.

Anything you can do in Microsoft has already been fully accomplished - years, and in some cases, even decades - earlier, in one of the 400 + IEEE POSIX systems. Some of the POSIX OSes are based upon Berkeley Software Distribution, and some use the Linux kernel.

If you want to try it on your desktop, without affecting your hard drive, get one of the 298 Live CD images at http://livecdlist.com

Now then, let's also clarify that the major 'Korean distro' is Hancom Linux, with an included 1500 applications. The key thing overlooked by Microsoft is that the OS must communicate natively in the BIG 5 Chinese languages, plus, Manga (Japanese), plus, Korean, and Thai. Not to mention, several other language sets, and, that a competent word processor that adheres to Internationally agreed OPEN DOCUMENT standards must be available and supported.

Microsoft has dragged it's feet on these needs.
Microsoft does NOT support world standards.
Microsoft does NOT publish it's standards.
Microsoft's modus operandi is to OWN YOUR DATA.
Microsoft has 102,000+ viral definitions, w0rms, unique to its code.
Microsoft products LOCK-IN the user, to forced upgrades that do not support archival products.

So, why would anyone interfere with FREE, and Open Source software? To attempt to CONTROL users, the market, and the free interchange of information. To block freewill, freechoice, and open development.

Read some reviews on 288+ FREE and OPEN OSes, http://distrowatch.com

Support? http://lugww.counter.li.org has 650+ Linux Users Groups, worldwide, listed.

Yahoo Groups lists over 65 SUPPORT groups!

Score: 0

By KingMotley

posted Oct 30, 2005 - 9:40 PM

Hmm...Too bad most of what you said is utter BS.

"8x Slower"?
Windows isn't slower than linux on anything important, in MOST cases, it is many times faster.

"very competent 400+ alternatives"?
400+? Come on, what are you counting? Minor linux versions? Red Hat 7.0.0, 7.0.1, and 7.0.2 doesn't count as 3 alternatives. And competent is a joke.

"more secure"?
According to whom exactly?

"Hotmail.com runs 14,000 BSD and linux servers"?
Yeah, when Microsoft BOUGHT hotmail, it as running on BSD and linux. They converted them to windows and now it's running faster and on a lot less hardware.

"Almost every Fortune 500 corporation, and 168 world governments, mandate the use of IEEE POSIX OSes"?
I've never heard that, considering I deal with a ton of them, unless you mean they demand windows which has a POSIX subsystem.

"Anything you can do in Microsoft has already been fully accomplished"?
Uh, yeah. Do I even need to start on this?

"The key thing overlooked by Microsoft"?
Uh, UNICODE is the underlying codebase for windows NT/2000/XP, that includes support for the BIG 5. BSD does not support unicode natively, so what was your point?

"Internationally agreed OPEN DOCUMENT standards"?
Uh, there is currently *1* major application that even supports your so-called internationally agreed standards. Where I work, and everyone who I have contact with the STANDARD is MS Office format, or PDF. If someone were to send me a document in that "standard", I'd send it back and tell whomever sent it to resend it in word/excel/access format, or plain text.

"So, why would anyone interfere with FREE, and Open Source software"?
What are you talking about? I don't see Microsoft interfering at all. I see a bunch of Open Source freaks whining about what Microsoft should/shouldn't be able to put in their own product. I think any one can see it's the weirdos that are trying to interfere with Microsoft, not the other way around.

Score: 0

By fewt

posted Oct 31, 2005 - 7:24 AM

"Windows isn't slower than linux on anything important, in MOST cases, it is many times faster."

Evidence please.

Score: 0

By bourgeoisdude

edited Oct 31, 2005 - 12:23 PM

Speed is a matter of opinion. Software really does not have much to do with speed, the hardware works just as fast. Like I explain to victims of spyware, spyware and viruses don't really slow your computer down--it is really quite fast to be able to attempt to spread malicious software to 255 local workstations on your network/internet per second, AND run your programs at the same time (MSBLAST does this). HOW they work, HOW they read data--that's the difference. Windows in and of itself uses more processor instruction sets than Linux. I have no direct proof, but I know that processors are designed more for MS needs than Linux needs, except on the RISC end that is. Why? Because MS is better? Not necessarily--MS drives the market though, so Intel and AMD kinda might want to listen to Microsoft's needs if they want to stay around.

BTW: MS is more efficient than Linux in most cases as he said, there is no direct proof of this, it is really subjective. Consider that most of the time IT people are pathetic morons and configure Windows in such a way that there are 12 useless processes running in the background that degrade from its true performance. Remember: XBOX OS is based on the Windows 2000/XP operating system, and it uses a 733MHz Pentium III!

"Yeah, when Microsoft BOUGHT hotmail, it [w]as running on BSD and linux. They converted them to windows and now it's running faster and on a lot less hardware."

Ouch! That's gotta hurt!

Score: 0

By fewt

posted Oct 31, 2005 - 12:37 PM

"I have no direct proof, but I know that processors are designed more for MS needs than Linux needs"

Intel and AMD both optimize their processors for Linux, and Windows (any OS really). AMD actively contributes to GCC, I think Intel may also but I'm not 100% on that.

MSs first, second, and third attempts to move hotmail off of FREEBSD, not Linux failed. It wasn't faster, actually they had thousands of complaints. I believe today they are doing it with more than 2x the number of servers however they have more users so it all balances out.

Score: 0

By gawd21

edited Oct 31, 2005 - 8:41 AM

Here you go: One major point. Most Linux distros are over 3 gigs minimum install. I have seen that Most Linux distros as vastly slower. Red hat everything, Mandrake and many others. SuSE 9, Ubuntu, and Kubuntu are faster, however SuSE 10 is just to damn large, more that twice a full install of WinXP even with all updates and normal installs.

EDIT: http://www.microsoft.com...topics/performance.mspx

http://www.linuxhardware...1725246&mode=thread

www.veritest.com/clients...crosoft/ms_netbench.pdf

Score: 0

By fewt

posted Oct 31, 2005 - 8:44 AM

LOL, please don't link to Microsoft's site for evidence supporting Windows being faster than Linux. 3rd party non-MS or Linux funded studies would be best.

SUSE 10 is HUGE, however SUSE 10 isn't Linux, it's SUSE 10 which contains the Linux kernel. My Ubuntu install is a single *CD* and it's pretty clean. You can't base an opinion of all Linux distros on one.

Point taken on the Doom performance site. That's juse one case, however the original poster said many cases. That's what I'm looking for the evidence proving.

Something about SUSE 10 though is that you get 1,000 utilities (give or take) and a usable OS out of the box. XP you don't get much of anything, yet it's 1/2 the size of a SUSE install. :-)

I wasn't trying to argue against Linux or Windows as they both have their strengths and weaknesses as you have shown with Doom 3. My beef is that the poster didn't substantiate the comment. Out of the box XP can be VERY slow, as can Linux.

Score: 0

By bourgeoisdude

posted Oct 31, 2005 - 12:21 PM

"Out of the box XP can be VERY slow, as can Linux."

That's because third party vendors pay PC manufacturers to put their CRAP preinstalled on Windows systems...

Score: 0

By fewt

edited Oct 31, 2005 - 3:07 PM

I don't disagree. :-)

XP out of the box with nothing installed on it isn't so bad. One major drawback though is the registry. One bad app can kill the OS.

Linux distributions on the other hand have no registry, but it also has 5000 configuration files (fortunately there are GUI tools for most of them).

Unfortunately though GNOME appears to be taking on a registry like substance using XML. I'm thinking that I'm not gonna be too happy with it.

My problem though :-D

Score: 0

By gawd21

posted Oct 31, 2005 - 9:18 AM

Yeah, I do like Ubuntu and Kubuntu, as I said thay are faster.

Score: 0

By kompressive

posted Oct 29, 2005 - 1:13 AM

This has nothing to do with the article.

Score: 0

By eunichman

posted Oct 29, 2005 - 2:27 AM

seems to me it has a lot to do with this article. Microsoft is once again screaming out threats of bullying tactics because some country is requesting microsoft actually ADHERE to anti-trust rulings imposed on it by the us and other countries. if ms doesnt want to follow the letter of the law then that makes them a criminal, and anyone, beit an individual, a corporation, state or country has every right to hold microsoft under more than normal scrutiny and make requests that are all reasonable demands and require misrosoft to actually6 follow past rulings and orders against them
This gentleman was illustrating this in a very clear and elequent manner, pointing out microsoft's history, reasons why some countries might be eyeing warily the monopoly microsoft, as well as illustrating that there are other alternatives.
as a final humorous note, the author of this post points out that microsoft themselves use linux servers over windows based ones. what kind of message does that send to large companies looking for secure and stable network computing, when a company develops and sells one product but used a competing product (that's free) to do the mission critical stuff? :)

Score: 0

By Niro

posted Oct 31, 2005 - 12:25 AM

"as a final humorous note, the author of this post points out that microsoft themselves use linux servers over windows based ones. what kind of message does that send to large companies looking for secure and stable network computing, when a company develops and sells one product but used a competing product (that's free) to do the mission critical stuff? :)"

Has anybody ever told you not to believe everything you read? Let me be the first to tell you then...don't believe everything you read....thanks now go do some research before you post brainwashed comments. :)

Score: 0

By ogman

posted Oct 29, 2005 - 7:28 AM

Agreed. Well said!

Score: 0

By drumcat

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 3:47 PM

They make a Korean version. Does that mean that Microsoft makes much money from Korea? Nope. North America and the EU pay MS because of our laws. If they lose a stand in countries there, it's detrimental to their income. If they fight and lose in Korea, so what. If they fight and win in Korea, it's a big deal. I think they're trying to get a win, and picking where they have the least to lose.

Score: 0

By jerrico

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 3:40 PM

If ms withdraws Windows from the Korea. The world will have more cracked versions of Windows.

Score: 0

By Neoprimal

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 3:02 PM

Being such a large company has it's downs too however....they CAN pull out, but if they do I suspect repercussions. So they can't really 'win' either way - they just have to do what the gov't of the country says.

Score: 0

By GeorgeSantayana

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 2:11 PM

Two-thirds of Microsoft's revenue comes from the US?

4% of the world population?

Thanks Americans for subsidizing OS & Office software development for the rest of the planet.

Score: 0

By spiked

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 1:23 PM

No soup for you!

Score: 0

By PC_Tool

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 2:03 PM

lmao!

awesome.

Score: 0

By Black-Wolf

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 12:27 PM

Yep!
Pull out!

Who gives a damn about Korean market anyway?
It's not as big as China after all, right?

Score: 0

By gawd21

edited Oct 28, 2005 - 12:57 PM

I would just pull it. Hell with them. You don't like my products then you don't have to buy them. I would just say, "You cry too much and I don't like you, so you may no longer buy my software".

EDIT: Thank you for the corrections in my punctuation.

Score: 0

By fewt

edited Oct 28, 2005 - 4:49 PM

Not sure they can do that, there may be economic ramifications that could possibly become legal ramifications for them if they do.

Not that it would stop them from trying LOL!

Score: 0

By eunichman

posted Oct 29, 2005 - 2:38 AM

lets see...
possible legal ramifications.
if a suit is already in the works or filed in the courts systems, pulling the product out and running is equivalent to an admission of guilt and could be quite possibly viewed as criminal in intent. Said country could - at its descretion, prosecute to the fullest extent of the law in that country and hold judgement against microsoft which ms would be unable to appeal to a higher court - as well as possibly levy heavy fines and/or jail time.

Score: 0

By gawd21

posted Oct 29, 2005 - 11:53 AM

This isn't a case of someone running while getting pulled over, here. I think you need to read the whole story and keep off the drugs.

Score: 0

By AaronDobbins

posted Oct 29, 2005 - 12:09 AM

What legal ramifications could come if they pull their product from the market? You cannot sue someone for not offering their products.

Score: 0

By fewt

edited Oct 29, 2005 - 11:16 AM

You can if it would potentially disrupt the economy of the entire country.

This is just one more fine example of why monopolies are illegal.

I wouldn't be surprised of Korea wrote some form of law making the officers of Microsoft corporation terrorists, and demanding the US extradite them.

Think about it, you can look at it from so many angles that it's scary.

Score: 0

By gawd21

edited Oct 29, 2005 - 12:00 PM

That would never fly. MS isn't breaking any laws, RealMedia just pushed Korea to do this and then backed out after they got the money.

Score: 0

By fewt

posted Oct 29, 2005 - 12:44 PM

Who's to say that's true? Only someone that practiced law and was versed in US, International, Korean laws can say for sure.

Score: 0

By bourgeoisdude

edited Oct 28, 2005 - 12:53 PM

This is funny...especially the last two paragraphs.

"Jupiter Research senior analyst Joe Wilcox suggested Microsoft could be trying to send regulators a message."

I'm sorry, but skimming through that, it sounds funny, like it took a senior analyst just to come up with that theory or something.

I think Microsoft is trying to make a point to the world here though--they're rich. They COULD pull from the EU and SURVIVE, too. Just like gawd21 said, I would just say "You cry to[o] much and I don't like you[,] so you may no longer buy my software."

Score: 0

By PC_Tool

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 12:51 PM

Hell, MS could shut it's doors *right now* completely, worldwide, and not suffer one iota for it.

They could pull their licenses from all users and close up shop right then and there.

"No more Windows, guys, sorry, we're done. Format your drives, you don't own it, we do, and we have decided you can't use it anymore. Goodbye."

License agreements are so much fun.

Score: 0

By bourgeoisdude

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 12:55 PM

Microsoft COULD be much worse than they are :P

Score: 0

By PC_Tool

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 1:05 PM

Heh... MS could be just about any damn thing they wanted...even good....if they had the balls for it.

And no, buying out, suing, and generall cutting down all opposition does in no way imply they have balls.

Score: 0

By gawd21

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 1:06 PM

"And no, buying out, suing, and generall cutting down all opposition does in no way imply they have balls." No, just lots of money.

Score: 0

By PC_Tool

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 2:03 PM

No argument there. :P

Score: 0

By fewt

posted Oct 28, 2005 - 11:24 AM

LOL

Score: 0