Firefox did well over 1 million downloads in the first 24 hours. Topped 10 million in the first month, and broke 25 million in less than 100 days. If you dont believe me, do a google search and check the figures.

More than 600,000 downloads exceed their expectation. They aren't comparing it to Firefox.

"Firefox may be garnering most of the attention as an alternative to IE, but Opera 8 has been met with a massive response from Internet users - so much so that new Opera download servers had to be installed." ...kinda looks like they are to me...

I think this was a very calculated attempt to relate Opera's popularity with that of Firefox....and it still isnt in the ball park.

i have beem using opera for the past year.i also use firefox and very ocassioanlly avant browser(only for pages which would open just with ie).the new version of opera is definitely an improvement upon the previous one.
although no browser i have used has been perfect ,but opera is the one which comes closest to perfection.its the one i can atleast completely rely upon for security atleast if not more.
i would just like opera developers to make an ad-bloacker too.that would really make a lot of people happy i guess.also though they have introduced text to speech capacity,it would be great if they included support for at&t natural voice technology.
mind you these are just a few improvements ,i like opera so much already that i have registered for it.

been an opera user since 6.0, been a fan since way before then (5.0 and previously releases.. i liked them but couldnt switch, not until 6.0)

i cant wait for 8.5 so i can upgrade from 7.54 (i never do the x.0 releases, only x.5.. usually just to make sure any major bugs are gone.. and because i customize opera so much its a pain to upgrade)

...and if that hadn't happened, there wouldn't have been near as many downloads. Seriously. Doing that is enough to make most servers burst into flames. (I think it's less of a problem with Firefox because of multiple mirros and the fact that many geeks are *already* using it.)

Um, Opera's servers were smoking BEFORE it even hit Slashdot. And most Slashdotters are rabid Firefox fanboys anyway.

Really? Funny it was posted on slashdot the same time it was posted here.

Well, I just installed Opera 8 and removed it after it rendered www.spyderco.com incorrectly. That site shows up fine in Firefox and IE. Opera is a no go. I can't believe it. The first site I go to Opera can't even display correctly :)

Hahaha.

eh? I se no difrence from ei to opera 8 here.. it must be in your imagination it does not work...

I see what you mean about the page not rendering properly Pipewrench,I just tried it with Opera 8 and Firefox and there is a big diference.

Not in your imagination at all.

I personally like both but lean towards Opera.
They have both came a long way.

erm, look at the menu

It's not the only page it wont render properly. Try hotmail. All this hype and the program doesnt render pages as well as IE..........I'm staying with FF......btw Firefox 1.0.4 beta is available on their ftp servers.

That site is using an old version of a menu system which is why it doesn't render well. The current version works flawlessly in Opera, try:

http://www.udm4.com/demo...l-absolute-top-left.php

What can Opera do when web developers fail to test their pages properly?

I admit I prefer to use IE, it has all the security features I need and I don't have problems. However, I was far less than impressed with firefox. Having downloaded the new Opera browser yesterday to try it out, it appears quite impressive. FireFox just doesn't have what the 'every-day home user' needs, and yes you can install the add-ons, but I'm talking about the average everyday home user. Opera, on the other hand, greatly exceeded my expectations (and the interface is certainly better than the beta).

Then again so many people say FF is so great. Am I missing something? I just don't see why anyone cares for it that much. Sure it works, it's stable, but so is Netscape and it actually has better functionality *IN MY OPINION* than FF. I really tried to be impressed by FF. Honest. Seriously, am I alone here?

NO! You aren't. I don't get it either.

It's all about the adblocking.

I hate ads. Give me something to block ads in the middle of a page and I'll use Internet Explorer. Right now when I use Firefox I see ZERO ads.

I have such a thing against ads being all intrusive that I will use whatever blocks them. There is no need to have a flash based ad start moving around in front of what you're reading and you can't do anything until it's done. That is crap.

Opera Rules... Gooo Opera take over the world with your browser masterpiece! FF bow down to your king...

That was lame.

Well. Apart from Adblock / Flash Blockin Firefox, I don't miss any features in Firefox. And i still enjoy a better / faster ( than firefox ) ans safer experience than IE/Firefox

It's the small touches of FF that I enjoy. Like the ability to search my bookmarks, the quick search feature and being able to find a string on a page as I type (rather than having an annoying Find window pop up that obscures the text). And, of course, the tabs. Plus, when Firefox crashes, it doesn't crash the whole shell like IE does.

But I understand the sentiment of being underwhelmed by Firefox. A lot about it that I've come to enjoy is made possible with extensions. The default skin looks like something from the mid-nineties and the tabs don't work nicely like they do with the TB extension.

I don't get how anyone can live without tabs, though. It's so slick. Fine, use Opera, Avant, Maxthon, FF, but IE in spawning a separate instance for each page is so slow and a navigational mess.

WTF is everyone doing talking about Firefox/IE here? This post is all about Opera. Anyway.. go Opera! Been a user for years and am constantly advocating it. I've had massive success with my latest attempts due to the overwhelming popularity of Opera 8 final :)

Go go go! :)

Done, www.admuncher.com, pay 25$ and you get a program that works for ALL BROWSERS and any app that accesses the web, and removes ads, popups, tables, div/spans, whatever you want. Try it out :)

Hmm...$25 or a free extension...tough decision

Gee, free extension or software that does 100x more than the free extension could ever do. I love you open source freaks frame of mind "If it aint free, its crap, god forbid I try it out"

It has nothing to do with open source...

Opera is pretty good, and getting better, Firefox is pretty good, and rapidly improving...

IE is a piece of crap that can run applications remotely - which should never have been allowed in the first place. It seems like 99% of windows security issues are directly related to that "feature"

I should have said a MAJORITY of OSS supporters are that way, there are a very limited group that actually maintain a sense of realism about them and can actually try something before putting it down and saying that their free product is sooo much better than a competing shareware program.

I love opera, it just doesnt support what I want, and from the looks of it never will. I dont like a browser that forces you to include features that you dont want (the same way people whine about what MS does with windows). It seems to be totally closed to third parties wanting to add stuff to it, and the users on their forums flame you to no end when you even hint at the topic. Until the day opera allows me to use roboform, which is FAR FAR superior to wand, I will be a loyal FF users (unless IE7 impresses me)

Hahahahaha...

> It's the small touches of FF that I enjoy. Like
> the ability to search my bookmarks, the quick
> search feature and being able to find a string
> on a page as I type (rather than having an
> annoying Find window pop up that obscures the
> text). And, of course, the tabs.

ALL of the things you mentioned ALREADY EXISTED IN OPERA YEARS AGO! Searching bookmarks, yep. You have been able to do that for ages, even using "quick search". Quick search for pages is called "inline find" or "type ahead find", and was in Opera ages before Mozilla added it. And yep, tabbed browsing came in Opera long before it appeared in Firefox as well.

> Plus, when Firefox crashes, it doesn't crash
> the whole shell like IE does.

Exactly the same with Opera! Only with Opera, you start where you left off before the crash!

> I don't get how anyone can live without tabs,
> though. It's so slick. Fine, use Opera, Avant,
> Maxthon, FF, but IE in spawning a separate
> instance for each page is so slow and a
> navigational mess.

Great, but what does all of this have to do with Opera?

Read this again:

ALL THE THINGS YOU LOVE IN FIREFOX WERE ALL IN OPERA FIRST, AGES BEFORE FIREFOX GOT THEM!

What is this, OSS FUD day? Hehe...

> I dont like a browser that forces you to
> include features that you dont want (the same
> way people whine about what MS does with
> windows).

Illogical and irrelevant argument. Opera keeps everything out of the user's way until he wants it. And besides, it's a smaller download than Firefox anyway, so it doesn't matter. Also, Firefox comes with a few features. By your logic, Firefox is "forcing it on you like MS". Please.

> It seems to be totally closed to third parties
> wanting to add stuff to it,

That's wrong. You can add toolbars, menus, bookmarklets, panels, and so on. There are lots of ways to extend Opera. It's very easy to customize!

> and the users on their forums flame you to no
> end when you even hint at the topic.

Wrong. They flame you when you troll and make obviously wrong and inflammatory statements like the above.

Yea, but ff lets you choose what you want in it, not what the dev feels you should have. Plus you dont have to pay for ad free browsing. Web browsers should be free, not something you have to pay for. Anyways, I can use opera without ads for free while using admuncher (Yes, it removes the ad's from opera's main windows).

> Illogical and irrelevant argument. Opera keeps
> everything out of the user's way until he wants it. And
> besides, it's a smaller download than Firefox anyway,
> so it doesn't matter. Also, Firefox comes with a few
> features. By your logic, Firefox is "forcing it on you like > MS". Please.

Show me a feature they force down your throat? If you dont want tabs, you dont get em in firefox, its easily configured to remove it in about:config. Popups stopped? Disable it. Opera forces you to use what the DEVELOPER puts in, or you cant use functionality like it at all. Show me one thing that FF forces on you?

> That's wrong. You can add toolbars, menus,
> bookmarklets, panels, and so on. There are lots of
> ways to extend Opera. It's very easy to customize!

Show me a single third party toolbar that you can integrate into opera? Wow, you can add a panel, that doesnt let me add a function to the browser I want to use (roboform, several toolbars, and several other utilities that work with every other web browser out there BUT opera).

> Wrong. They flame you when you troll and make
> obviously wrong and inflammatory statements like the
> above.

So, by requesting opera support a third party app, I am now a troll and am obviously wrong? When a user on their forums comes on and calls me an idiot (a user that has over 3000 posts on their boards, not just some newb) for even suggesting it? You dont call that flaming? Wow, I must be out of date. You still have yet to prove how my statements are wrong. This is another thing I've noticed about opera users, they seem to preach it as the gospel, you dont run into them often, but when you do they are 100x worse than any FF supporter I've ever seen. Just look at you, you jumped at the chance to try and prove someone wrong who bad mouthed your beloved browser. I will never bad mouth someone for wanting to use another browser or say one is better than the other. I use FF and IE exclusively right now, because both have their purposes and both work extremely well

I use FF because I chose to, and because it supports what I NEED IT TO, not what the dev feels I should use and I can customize it to have exactly what I WANT in it. If opera were able to open its doors to THIRD PARTIES, not opera developed "extensions", then I will reconsider it. Until then, nope.

By the way, dont get me wrong. I love opera, I consider it a great browser, its just its closed standards that turn me off to it completely since they dont allow a user to put what they want into the browser. Also, I will not force my browser down your throat, use whatever works for you, but please, dont bad mouth me for making claims against your browser than you dont happen to agree with

Again, opera is only this secure because no one really uses it. Once it goes mainstream or gets as much support behind it as ff, then you will see how secure it really is. Even the FF developers claim that their original statements of it being more secure are now being questioned due to the simple fact that more people use it, and now more people are trying to exploit it. If opera hits it big, or even raises its market share a little, you will see more and more exploits come into play

I have to agree with you - Opera vs. Firefox or Opera vs. IE or IE vs. Firefox or whatever match-up you want to come up with is totally pointless. What it really comes down to is personal preference.

My personal preference, first and foremost, is to have something I download and use everyday to work the way I want it to work the first time I open it up. I don't like the idea of downloading a "simple" browser that has endless extensions and add-ons. My idea of fun is definitely not searching through hundreds of extensions to find the one that works the best. Look, tabs are great, and I'm sure there are extensions out there that can make tabs in Firefox work a whole lot better, but without having to do anything, Opera's tabs work just fine without any additional help.

Again, this is my personal preference - I would rather have some developer on Norway decide which implementation of tabs works best and then include that in the browser. Saves me the hassle. And it's not like the Opera people haven't been innovating - I've been using Opera since the 3.x days and I can assure you that much has changed since then.

Now I'm not saying that this way of doing this is any better or worse than Firefox or IE - I'm just saying it's what I prefer. After all, you want to use something that you like. And I don't just like Opera. I admire it. It makes me happy to use it. I wait impatiently for every new release to see what those crazy Opera developers were going to do next. Yeah, I might be a little nuts, but I think it's nice to use software that you respect.

"Yea, but ff lets you choose what you want in it, not what the dev feels you should have."

All programs include what the developers put in there, and you can actually add lots of things to Opera, such as:

http://nontroppo.org/wiki/WebDevToolbar

Comparing Opera to Microsoft just because Opera includes lots of usefull stuff is silly. It's just flamebait/trolling.

And the fact is that most of it is hidden by default, and Opera is *still* smaller and faster than Firefox. So the fact that it has all these features doesn't matter - you can just ignore them if you don't use them, and they don't slow down the program.

"Plus you dont have to pay for ad free browsing."

That's irrelevant, now isn't it? It's got nothing to do with the quality of the program. Firefox exists because Mozilla is in the pockets of huge corporations like Sun and IBM, but Opera actually has to create a quality product that people want to buy to survive. They've been around for ten years.

"Web browsers should be free, not something you have to pay for."

That's hardly your call, now is it? I can make a comment like "water should be free, not something you have to pay for", yet people buy loads and loads of bottled water, and some places you *need* bottled water because the water coming out of the tap is too contaminated.

"Show me a feature they force down your throat? If you dont want tabs, you dont get em in firefox, its easily configured to remove it in about:config. Popups stopped? Disable it."

So the popup blocker is forced down users' throats, because they have to actually disable it. Q.E.D.

"Opera forces you to use what the DEVELOPER puts in, or you cant use functionality like it at all."

That is clearly wrong. You can extend Opera in lots and lots of ways, and even if it's more limited than Firefox extensions, it's more than most people will ever need. Example again:

http://nontroppo.org/wiki/WebDevToolbar

"Show me one thing that FF forces on you?"

As you explained, the popup blocker.

"Show me a single third party toolbar that you can integrate into opera?"

http://nontroppo.org/wiki/WebDevToolbar

"Wow, you can add a panel, that doesnt let me add a function to the browser I want to use (roboform, several toolbars, and several other utilities that work with every other web browser out there BUT opera)."

Maybe you can't add Roboform, but Opera already has the Wand, and you can fill in info in Personal information that will be used for auto-completion of forms.

"So, by requesting opera support a third party app, I am now a troll and am obviously wrong?"

I guess he's referring to making groundless accusations and silly comparisons with MS.

"When a user on their forums comes on and calls me an idiot (a user that has over 3000 posts on their boards, not just some newb) for even suggesting it? You dont call that flaming?"

Can't say I've seen that. I've seen people come along and start ranting, raving and flaming, and spewing filth at Opera. I can't really blame Opera fans who get bored with trolls like that. And considering the MS comments, etc., I think you most likely posted flamebait, and got what was coming for ya.

"This is another thing I've noticed about opera users, they seem to preach it as the gospel, you dont run into them often, but when you do they are 100x worse than any FF supporter I've ever seen."

Then you haven't seen a lot of Firefox supporters. You know, Firefox supporters are getting a real bad reputation on the web these days. Ok, so Opera fans may jump people who make outrageous and false statements about Opera, but *Firefox* fans jump at anyone who uses another browser and talks about why that browser is cool.

See the difference?

- Opera fans: Defend Opera against FUD and lies.
- Firefox fans: Attack anyone who doesn't use Firefox.

"I will never bad mouth someone for wanting to use another browser or say one is better than the other."

Actually, you are spreading FUD about how Opera fans got back at you for trolling in the Opera forums, and you are comparing Opera to MS, and claiming that they are forcing thing down people's throats. See, you *are* badmouthing Opera and its fans, and also Opera Software.

"Also, I will not force my browser down your throat, use whatever works for you, but please, dont bad mouth me for making claims against your browser than you dont happen to agree with"

Well, you should stop claiming that Opera forces stuff down your throat, that it is like MS, and you should stop accusing Opera and its fans for various things.

Opera doesn't force anything down your throat, in case you didn't notice. You are not forced to use Opera at all.

As someone who has used M$IE, 0pera AND Firef0x from a long way back....

I started off with NCSA Mosaic ;-) anyone remember it?

Then came Netscape and IE If I remember correctly version 2 & 3

Also along came Opera

And Firefox from around v0.6

As I have used all of them through current versions, here's my opinion:

1) FF/Opera - both in the same class. Not prone to crashes like IE, has far less problems and allows tabs(Does not have ActiveX) Now, don't go starting about how useful/convenient/flashy it is. It is all that, it is also a rather very unique risk).

2) Both FF/Opera are evolving and being updated on a far quicker basis than IE. Sure IE has jumped version numbers quickly, but improvements are few and far between.

3) IE is a memory hog, and all versions since 3.0 I consider bloated (3.0 ran decently quite a long time back)

4) IF IE development staff put as much effort into improving the browser as they did in putting out patches every tuesday, it would have overtaken the other two long ago.

ergo, Opera/FF - TIED

IE - some small distance behind. can catch up but needs work.

http://www.monroeworld.com/operafilter/ theres your thing

I have tried FF and Opera but still prefer IE.

IE is a bit bloated but I do not have crashing issues and it works on every page I use.

I was using the heck out of FF because I love tabs, but I was having huge issues with certain webpage, primarly the ones I use on a daily basis to print boarding passes for flights or receipts for purchases.

If IE added TABs I would never consider changing. I already use google toolbar and Roboform to suppliment the other things I want.

joshpx sent this
"Read this again:

ALL THE THINGS YOU LOVE IN FIREFOX WERE ALL IN OPERA FIRST, AGES BEFORE FIREFOX GOT THEM!"

Read this josh, for all your attempts at flaming and satire..........all those things in FF are FREE. And FREE of annoying ads.

What I really like about Opera proponents is their lame attempts to defend their decision to pay $40.00 for an internet browser that doesnt work $1.00 better than most of the free browsers available. Why dont you just admit you got taken for a ride and move on?

IE has too many security holes.

James
http://www.du168.net/big5/

I still do not understand why people who hate adds don't install a web filter on their systems. There are plenty of them available and some are free. They take at most about 30 minutes to configure and then you get few, if any, adds no matter which browser you choose. In fact Proxomitron is still around and has new support,even for SSL.