A $1000.00 for a copy of Windows. I Have 2 of Whatever The "PC Rat" is Smoking.

$1000 for Windows? Dude, I TOTALLY want that version. Does it come with a Real Doll?!

...

"It costs Microsoft
only peenies to
produce one copy of
Windows XP and
Windows Vista"

...

Silly, boy ! ~That's~ the cost of copying Windows
to a retail CD. It doesn't take into account the
development cost of Windows.

When you factor in that WinVista has been in
development for over five years, the retail price
ought to be $1,000/unit to reimburse Microsoft
for ~years~ of salaries it paid employees who
accomplished NOTHING all that time !

...

The Computer Rodent

...

Using Vista now, it couldn't have possibly taken 5K employees 5 years to write this.

I bet they didn't start really working Vista until crunch time.

Considering they scratched pretty much everything they had done prior to Win2k3 and began working from that kernel, I'd say your pretty much spot-on. Anything they'd done "longhorn" prior to that had to be redone.

If any of you remember XP SP2, they took a hell of a lot of their manpower from Longhorn and dedicated it to securing XP. That delayed Longhorn long enough to build it from 2k3 code. I say that's a blessing.

They have how many billions of dollars in profit?

I'd say that there is no excuse, they have plenty of money to pay folks.

A $1000.00 for a copy of Windows. I Have 2 of Whatever The "PC Rat" is Smoking.

It also seems MacOS is gaining more markets these days.

Sad...

Why?

I'm a Windows user myself, but I've always held the opinion that competition = good.

If any company gains share in a Windows dominated market, I'm all for it.

RC1 is great, but it stole features from Apple McOS Tiger... and those features were more than 2 years old.

Remember the apple commercials talking about how the intel processor has been "set free" on the apple platform? Same thing, microsoft took the appearance of a mac and made it better. Thereby setting it free.

then I guess one could say mac stole the media center idea from microsoft...everyone borrows everything from everyone...nothing is a hundred percent original...I dont see how everyone says Vista looks like Mac when it doesnt it looks like XP with a new facelift and icons that are no longer heavily pixelated...

I invented the keyboard. Everybody stole it from me.

Old McOS had a farm...

...iE iI iE iI iO.

i really don't get why people get off bashing windows. maybe to boost their ego? constructive critizism is useful but worthless rambling a monkey at a typewritter can reproduce in 20 minutes is a waste of time. if you feel to release your pent up energy go hack localhost.

Because for every good feature M$ puts in windows; they put in a half dozen that drive the users nuts. For example, the requirement of secure video paths for HD content, what user wants that?

Any user that want to play HD movies in the near future, that's who.

MS didn't create the spec. They *do* have to follow it if they want those movies (Blu-Ray, HD DVD) to work in their OS.

Hate to break it to ya, but MS isn't the bad guy here. It's all on the MPAA and to a lesser degree Sony and Toshiba.

All MS is doing is supporting the hardware and the requirements necessary to support non-degraded playback.

well in regards to annoying features:

In xp

don't you just hate autoupdate and how if you choose to use it will either keep bugging you to restart or will restart your pc eventually. I just hope vista doesn't have more crap like that. It's a pain to iron out those kind of annoyances. As for secure video paths, I'm sure someone will figure out ways around it. I think after a year or so vista will be "tweakable" enough for power users to be happy.

Exactly!!! This new standard doesn't apply to just computers either. All new HD displays, a/v recievers, dvd players, etc. will have to conform to it. The good thing is that this encryption method has already been broken.

Screen caps don't really cut it. ;)

Take a read. It's only a matter of time until everybody has a little black box to defeat this garbage. Reminds me of the DirecTV days. Just remember to order yours COD, under a false name and ship it to your office.

http://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/?p=1005

*laughs*

Ya know the percentage of DTV folks who bought and used the decryption devices?

Marginal at best.

HDMI will keep the *vast* majority of both casual and software-only hackers out of the piracy loop unless a software hack is made.

A "black-box" isn't going to cut it.

*chuckles*

Actually, if you read the link I left, a black box is the only way to decrypt the SIGNAL. Decrypting HD or Blu-Ray DVD source material is another matter entirely. You can't hack HDCP with software.

As far as the DirecTV thing, which wasn't even decryption at all, the numbers were in the tens of thousands. You can find this out from a number of sources including the reports on FBI raids of distribution warehouses for the devices. Sure, it's a small percentage but it was enough that it included "casual" hackers.

Don't assume everything everybody types is wrong, some of us know things.

LOL you missed the point. Thats a requirement before they can include it. DOH

NEVER CHANGE A RUNNING SYSTEM

°__°

But, hey - they will even buy the rope on which they'll gonna hang . . .

Way to take a quote out of context to suit your own agenda. You must work for a politician.

WTF? Who is this Defcon guy?

The Comments Below Are Reserved For "Grazer" whose comments are listed by scrolling download this page...

There is no doubt that "Grazer" is dumba** Microsoft's fan. "Grazer" reminds me of Bizarro who is a member of the Legion of Doom on the Superfriends cartoon series. If you can remember "Bizarro" thinks backwards.

Hmm, I still haven't seen you back up your original claims. I guess you can't defend them.

RC1 KICKS BUTT!!!! Beta 2 was extremely slow, annoying, and had many unfinished parts that would show up when you clicked on something. RC1 runs way smoother than my Windows XP installation, and the Internet is unbelievable, and runs at max speed all the time. Seriously, something was done with the networking, and I am amazed. I am not sure what DEFCON_360 was talking about below. I only have 512MB and a 3.2Mhz HT(533Mhz bus) processor, and RC1 still is fast. Apps open and close almost instantly, unlike some of the pauses you may encounter even on a fresh XP installation. I did have to connect to Microsoft to download drivers for my TV and sound card, but that only took a minute. Download RC1 as soon as you can!!! I don't think Linux has a chance in the home once the masses get a hold of this. The two other people at my job that installed RC1, are also pleasantly surprised with this OS.

Yes, for sure....I am still unconvinced that I need Vista, but I have to say the differences between Beta 2 and RC1 are remarkable. So much faster and Media just rocks. i would switch to Media center in Vista just for the cool transparency effects alone.

So, needed or not (I am leaning towards not) Vista RC1 is a huge improvement over BETA2 and is worth another look.

It's obvisously that "digitalking" doesn'r know the difference between a fast computer and a slow computer. If you have more than 20 processes running in the background than your computer is running only at 40% of its speed.

Define that logic.

BWAHAHAHA

Oh boy. I really would love to see the logic behind this. What is your basis for your statement? Or are you just throwing out stuff?

Interesting observation. Would you mind sharing the logic behind it?

This junk doesn't work in VMWare on two different systems with two different VMWare products. One an AMD64 w/ 1GB the other a Duron 950 w/ 700MB..

What's up with that?

It's due to an issue with Vista conflicting with the VMWare video adapter that it seems to hang after the beginning of the setup. Add these lines to your *.vmx file and you'll be able to install Vista. After you're done installing then install the VMWare Tools and then comment out or remove those two svga lines.

Lines to add to *.vmx file:
svga.maxWidth = "640"
svga.maxHeight = "480"

You can read more at:
http://www.joelonsoftwar.../items/2006/09/08b.html
http://www.vmware.com/co...d.jspa?messageID=467411

Alternate Method (installing drivers at setup):
http://www.vmware.com/co...D=472642��;

Alternate Method (Stevie Wonder Solution):
http://www.vmware.com/co...p;start=30&tstart=0

I'll give this a shot, thanks!

This seems to work, thanks again!

Darn!

bluescreen: bugcode_usb_driver

It seems to work ok after the first bluescreen LOL

If this is a sample of what Vista brings..

;-)

... on VMware

... still Vista

... on VMWare. That's like complaining that MacOS doesn't run properly on your PC.

I have done upgrades from before the Beta 2 builds on a laptop and I am suprised at the stability. I like the address bar on explorer, and IE7's tab behavior. Unfortunatly, setting up 802.1x + PEAP + MS-CHAP v2 + nondomain user is still an exercise in clicking.

Free download: http://keznews.com

Are you kidding me? Microsoft Vista is doom from the beginning to the end. I can't believe people will actually go out and buy this piece of CRAP. I have been testing Vista for the last 4 months, All I have to say there are going to be a lot of people diappointed when they buy or install Vista on the computer and/or laptop.

The computer system used to test Microsoft Vista is a Intel Pentium D 2.8 GHZ, 1.5 GIG RAM, 160 GIG 7200 SATA HD, NVIDIA GeForce 7300 GT

Here are the top 5 reasons to avoid Microsoft Vista:

1) First of all, one good rule of thumb to always remember when upgrading your operating system: "IF IT WORKS... DON'T FIX IT..." It costs Microsoft only peenies to produce one copy of Windows XP and Windows Vista, they sale these operating systems at a $100.00 and more.

Talkabout price gouging... Microsoft needs to fined substantially...

2) Second of all, Vista has a fancier interface which no computer guru cares about. This includes over 90% of Windows Users.

3) Third of all, Vista has a corrupted TCP/IP configuartion which will drop a high speed internet connection. I've been using a 6MB download. Windows XP Pro runs at top speed.

4) Fourth of all, the security features in Vista are useless. All a computer user has to do is download ZoneAlarm Free from http://www.zonelabs.com. This firewall will protect your computer from incoming and outgoing internet traffic.

5) Finally, Microsoft Internet Explorer 6 and 7 are the number one rerason why people receive spyware on the computer. To reduce spyware just download Mozilla Firefox 1.5.0.6 from http://www.mozilla.org/ IT'S FREE..

One Final Thought... It You Want To Avoid Spyware On Your Computer...

Always Remmeber: "IF YOU DON'T WANT TROUBLE... THAN DON'T GO LOOKING FOR IT..."

1) First of all, one good rule of thumb to always remember when upgrading your operating system: "IF IT WORKS... DON'T FIX IT..." It costs Microsoft only peenies to produce one copy of Windows XP and Windows Vista, they sale these operating systems at a $100.00 and more.

It costs pennies if that to burn data on to a CD/DVD, yes. However, it does not cost pennies to produce one copy of Vista. Think of the millions of dollars that MS had to spend paying its employees to create Vista, and the millions spent on research going into Vista, and the cost of equipment and business space to performt the R&D, and the cost of the media the product is sold on and the cost to market the product, and don't forget the cost to support the product after it is sold. Then divide that by the number of legitimately sold copies of the product. That is how much is costs MS to make a copy of Vista or XP.

2) Second of all, Vista has a fancier interface which no computer guru cares about. This includes over 90% of Windows Users.
90% of Windows users are "gurus"? Hahahahah, Hahahhahaha, OMG I hurt my side. Seriously though, I used to think the same way. Longing for all the wasted CPU cycles used to draw windows on the screen. I stuck in DOS for a long time. Then I hesitated going from Win2K to WinXP. Now I am thinking the graphics are a bit excessive too; but at least this time, the graphics can offload to the GPU and give me back some lost CPU cycles.

I have been testing Vista for the last 4 months...3) Third of all, Vista has a corrupted TCP/IP configuartion which will drop a high speed internet connection. I've been using a 6MB download. Windows XP Pro runs at top speed.
It's been BETA!!!!

4) Fourth of all, the security features in Vista are useless. All a computer user has to do is download ZoneAlarm Free from http://www.zonelabs.com. This firewall will protect your computer from incoming and outgoing internet traffic.
They are useless because there is a free alternative? Interesting logic. There are free versions of other operating systems, that must mean windows is useless. Let's all put are grandmas on Linux. (No offense to any computer literate grandmas out there, you just need to realize you are in the minority for your age bracket.)

5) Finally, Microsoft Internet Explorer 6 and 7 are the number one rerason why people receive spyware on the computer.

...

Always Remmeber: "IF YOU DON'T WANT TROUBLE... THAN DON'T GO LOOKING FOR IT..."

IE is not the number one reason people get spyware, lack of knowledge of safe computing is the reason. You countered your own IE bash. I still primarily use IE, and have no spyware. Do I use 3rd party software and hardware solutions to protect myself? Yes. Should I have to? No. Would I continue to if Windows became impenetrable? You bet. Because no software is impenetrable. The only safe computer is an unplugged one.

Should a not so savvy user have to learn about 3rd party products and personally go out and get them to have a modicum of safety? No. I found your post not only ignorant, but dangerous. Do you encourage people to avoid updates too?

P.S. I bet you would've bashed Vista for not having security features if that were the case.

/rant

Perfect, yeah what he said.

As for a few addons, vista with its many versions is going to confuse the living daylights out of people. What will oem's provide? The basic, then bug users with popups by the clock to upgrade to the next higher version, or taunt users with some new feature if they upgrade, all versions will be on one DVD, just features are locked down according to your key code.

As or security, after rc1 is loaded I already got several security updates. It's not even out the door yet and Microsoft is finding vulnerabilities. As for stability, usefulness and features.

It is not exactly stable, I installed a rc1 version a week later windows defender made the computer unresponsive. I hit the quick reset button and I get the message after post, read disc error press ctr-alt-Del. I knew it wasn't my hard drive. I had to reinstall from scratch, something had reformatted the c drive while windows vista was running. Literally the formatted space down to the last megabyte was free when I examined the hard drive when I went to reinstall. The D partition was fine and it reinstall to the C drive with no problems.

So either I got some kind of new virus that writes over the mbr, and the c drive or vista has got some serious issues.

As for features, the one feature that is pretty neat is the full backup integrated in vista. Now to me that sounds like a antitrust lawsuit waiting to happen, along with windows defender. Why didn't they just do it all up and integrate a basic antivirus? Who cares about lawsuits and such, they know they are untouchable, unless they are afraid of symantec or whoever.

As for the 3d interface, yeah it has transparent menu bars and cool 3d effects when you open and close or minimize windows. That is about it, everything has been rearranged, moved confused. Driver support is not there yet, as performance with my 3d card which is nvidia stunk. Drivers from other manufacturer's are not there yet, like canon scanners.

I know it will be in my hands eventually anyway so I might as well just say oh well. But I have a slight indication that this will be the slowest upgrade yet. Only people buying new computers or are forced to upgrade for some other reason which i can't think of will go for it. So looks like Microsoft and their stock will have to wait till the next windows release. I don't see people buying a new computer just to get vista either, just not worth it.

There is no doubt that "Grazer" is dumba** Microsoft's fan. "Grazer" reminds me of Bizarro who is a member of the Legion of Doom on the Superfriends cartoon series. If you can remember "Bizarro" thinks backwards.

"It costs Microsoft only peenies to produce one copy of Windows XP and Windows Vista, they sale these operating systems at a $100.00 and more."

There is no doubt that DEFCON_360 is a dumba** Microsoft bashing troll. Or an idiot, take your pick. I choose all of the above.

It's obvisously that "digitalking" doesn'r know the difference between a fast computer and a slow computer. If you have more than 20 processes running in the background than your computer is running only at 40% of its speed.

Yet another dumba** fan of Microsoft's. Someday the NT/2000 based 32bit kernel will be no more.

Define that logic.

Don't you loose points everytime you post in the troll games ?

http://www.criticalmiss.com/issue9/troll1.html

1.) Windows Vista cost billions to develop. You are an idiot.

2.) 90% of Windows users are idiots, not Guru's. You are one of the 90%.

3.) Your NIC drivers are broken or you've been ****ing with your TCP config. My 3C905 works *beautifully*. You are an idiot.

4.) NO firewall prevents a user from being an idiot. Vista's security goes beyond a simple firewall. A firewall cannot protect you, you are an idiot.

5.) The number one reason people get spyware is because they click every damned button they see. IE7 can run in protected (sandboxed) mode, preventing such apps from getting to the OS. You, sir, are a complete moron.

One final thought:

You are a dumba**. If you want avoid looking stupid and imbecilic, stop posting. Like, yesterday.

Why does it not surprise me in the least that you agree with that idiot?

lol,
nice

-edit-

I've been using it for a week now and I have even grown to favor the sidebar. I was going to uninstall it last night but when I really thought about it, I'd kind of miss it. So until I have a real reason to go back to XP, I'm going to keep running Vista. However, MCE2005 still sits on my media center PC. TV always takes priority.

MCE2005 is a fine piece of software. Can Vista add to the experience without making it junky or complicated?

It'd be an interesting test to see if Vista's Media Center capabilities are up to snuff yet.

I threw it on a spare HD on my Media Center to test it and it ran fine for about 8 hours. But this was on Sunday and the season premiere for The Simpsons and Family Guy aired that night. That's when I decided to swap back the the MCE05 drive just to be safe. Also, I need nVidia to get their control panel junk fixed to I can resize the screen to fit my busted rear-projection TV.

There is one shortcoming in Vista RC1's Media Center software. You can't play CD audio directly from a CD! You have to rip the CD to the hard disk by exiting Media Center and using Windows Media Player.

I was impressed. Stuck my postcode into the setup wizard and it automagically configured both my Terrestrial DVB and Analogue TV channels. Seems to be far better than the stuff Hauppauge foist upon you.

Getting a XBox 360 soon so we'll see what the media extender capabilities are like.

As I have a Microsoft Action Pack sub, i'll be getting the Ultimate version anyway when it's RTM.

In a word, yes. I was well impressed. Only downside is my Hauppauge IR remote doesn't work but I suspect that's just a driver issue.

That is odd. Doesn't sound like something they'd do on purpose....you don't have to rip DVD's top disk to play 'em in MCE, do ya?

heh...

Considering the Action Pack costs less than the Retail Edition of Vista Ultimate will cost and includes just about every piece of software Microsoft is selling, yeah, it's pretty much a must-have nowadays.

I need to try this out to see if VMware has anything to fix (when using Vista as the host). VMware 5.5 doesn't work properly on Vista 5536 due to vmnetx driver issues. Maybe 5600 will entice EMC to crank out a fix for that.

Reviews from Internet and friends have been very positive for beta softwrae. This is the first build I plan to install. It's going to take a lot to move me away from my MCE2005 though.

Funny, I thought the industry comments were generally far from "positive"?

I've found it to be quite reliable for a beta and use it on my production laptop.

The only issues I've had are with the protected mode in IE - causes IE to use 100% cpu usage at times - although I've found a way around this.

And lately, I've had a few blue screens at boot, but a reboot has corrected.

I'm also running office 2007 and its all working quite well.

The anti-microsoft crowd reviews are ALWAYS negative. Unfortunately you don’t have to walk far to trip over one of their sniveling members.

although I've found a way around this.

Um....

...and that would be?

Probably to disable protected mode.

Which is not a workaround.

The reviews look good (especially compared to the older builds, which seemed to work fine on my system). I've been holding back on installing this one (due more to laziness than anything else). I may have to motivate myself to install the damned thing.

With my luck, this build, getting great reviews, will trash my system. (Since the old builds with horrible reviews ran just fine)

Judging from your other posts in this thread, I'm guessing your start up sound of choice would be, "you're an idiot?"

Nah. I stick with the Windows default. It'd probably work well for you though.

LOL! The usual snappy retort.

Vista is looking very good. But there are still lots of bugs that need to be fixed.

Like The Autoplay which sometimes does not work for card readers.

..and the hyperlink issue in Outlook 2003.

maybe its something I have overlooked but Itunes is a nightmare on Vista the autoplay keeps coming up even after turning it off...its possible I missed an option but very annoying...I am sure it will be fixed before its released just a bit of a headache