PS3's release lineup is pathetic so far. I hope Sony's angle won't be that PS3 has the best games, because that is certainly not the case.

First,I am writing this having read the article but not having read the 20 comments yet. OK--these results don't really indicate much, only because the XBOX 360 is $300-$400 and PS2 has been $150 down to the now $130. Who will sell more? The less expensive one wins. So, in a way, this could be an indication that XBox 360 sales will be higher than PS3, based on that aspect.

Why is it comparing two different gen. systems? How about XBox vs. PS2 during the same time frame, mmm?

"...however, should the PlayStation 3 not do as well as Sony hoped, continuing strength in the PS2 could buoy the company for years to come."

Well--yes and no. What is the current COM (Cost Of Materials) for the PS2? I imagine it is actually higher than $130. PS2 is down because the games are selling, but they cannot depend on console sales alone as the folks below me point out. Sony makes little if any profit from the PS2 console sales IMO. The defective PS2 consoles are hurting them not helping them IMO.

I seem to recall reading that Sony started breaking even on PS2's about 2 years ago.

I reckon the BOM for PS2 today is about $80-$100.

And that is why it is such a peice of junk.

I can almost gauranteed that the reason PS2 sales continue to climb is that people are having to buy replacements. I have gone through THREE playstations. THREEE. It pisses the heck out of me how s***ty the PS2 is, its like they made that sucker out of paper. The only reason why i bought replacements is that i have a ton of games, huge investment, it would hurt to not play them.

Same here. I have the PS2, and played about 150 hours with it, and now it skips when reading disc.

If the Nintendo come out below $250 i'll get that first but am defiently going to get the PS3. Just say no to the XBOX 360 :)

While your waiting for vapor and spending on a blue-ray player you likely don't need, I am playing wonderful next gen games on my XBOX 360. And I didn't have to wait or spend a huge fortune.

I don't get this Sony fanboy attitude (don't call me a MS fanboy either, I just bought it cause it exists and has some fun nice looking games - I LOVE Fight Night and Oblivion).

A agree with you.
I can't stand Sony fanboys attitudes. The price is what is so great about the Xbox 360 and the upcoming Nintendo Revolution (Wii sounds gay, what can I say). The price of the PS3 turns me away from it instantly. I dont have 500 or 600 dollars to pull out of my pocket to spend on a game system. I can either buy a Premium Xbox 360 with an extra controller and 3 games for the same price as a single premium ps3.

Simple factor here: Games.

The PS2 has a huge library of games which is going to appeal to more people hence the larger sales.

The 360 is great, but game numbers are low. Once more games are released the 360 numbers will pick up.

I have both systems and I haven't touched the PS2 since the 360 came out, however I get the itch to do so every once in a while when I get tired of the 10 or so games I have on the 360.

Bingo. Close the thread; he nailed it.

I agree, but I don't really play much xbox games anymore, they look so dated (ps2 would be real bad).

Games are it, and 360 will be WAY ahead of PS3 at PS3 launch (really who wants to play ps1 or ps2 on a large digital screen that the ps3 supports? Anyone want to watch the huge pixels and bad textures that are inherrent in those games? Sure as heck not me)

I just want one that has excellent games, graphics, and is fun to play. For me its 360 since I can go play it right now :)

"I agree, but I don't really play much xbox games anymore, they look so dated (ps2 would be real bad)."

Yah, I agree with you. I don't have a PS2 but when I go to my friends house and play a game on it, wow, the graphics are just awful. Look at the Xbox 360. The games for it are only using about 20 percent of what the 360 is capable of doing and games such as PGR3 and DOA4 look just spectacular.

The Xbox 360 is just too damed expencive!

Double ditto for the PS3

Indeed, everyone has a pricepoint for which they can justify spending money on something like a game console/entertainment device.

This is WHY PS2 and original XBox are still selling. Each time they drop the price, a new wave of adopters buy them, and then spur development of software titles. There are still decent XBox and PS2 titles being released, despite the new consoles here and soon to be here.

The numbers for the PS2 sales are actually better than shown here. PS2 has been outselling XBox360 2:1 up until very recently.

Microsoft has averaged 246,000 console sales each month, while the PS2 has seen an average of 473,000 units.

No wonder Sony is not in any rush to launch the PS3. Microsoft are selling a fraction of the units, and losing money on every one, Sony are selling many more, and making money on the hardware AND the software..

This is in XBox's strongest territory (US), I would expect the gap to be even wider in Asia and Europe.

Mark, lets not be overexaggerating.. you are including December numbers in those figures which give a false impression. The true ratio is much less... as in reality those sales numbers are closer to 300k per month, versus 200k for Xbox 360. Still a big difference, but not quite as dramatic.

P.S. thanks for the tip by the way. :)

-- insert xbox 360 bashing here --

*** cricket !! cricket !! ***
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--- tumbleweed passes

-- insert sony ps3 bashing here --

Why would we bash a much better unit? We are waiting for the new PS3. Those of us that have been following this fued for years know, PS3 will turn Xbox on its ear.

Yes, its 600 bucks. but considering you only buy a new console every 3 or 4 years, and in the case of the PS3 it will be 5 years, at $125 a year, that's not a bad investment.. Hell you pay more than that to rent a DVR from cable companies.

rijp - I've watched your comments for a while now. I think you've really bashed your credibility into smithereens and outed yourself as someone with a heavy and unjustified bias with this latest comment.

Whether the PS3 does well or not, I can hardly see how it will turn the Xbox on it's ear. Anyone with an objective viewpoint would admit that the Xbox and the 360 are very competent efforts and should be respected in their own right as legitimate choices. Not something clearly inferior as you make it sound, while justifying the high price of the PS3 as well.

If you really were objective you would point out flaws in both sides and at least cop to the fact that both companies have something to offer.

Of course, to do that, you'd have to totally change your attitude, and I doubt you will do that any time soon.

I for one, will begin to ignore your comments more and more.

And no. I am not an Xbox fanboy. Just someone who dislikes idiocy.

Agree with paragraphs 2 and 3

I agree with your comment. there's no data to support PS3 turning anything on it's ear. In fact, my impression is that even though PS3 will come out, it will be a "less powerful" machine than the xbox 360.

That said, it's the games that makes the console for the most part, and to a lesser extent it's power (don't get me wrong, the power is important for good games, but they need to be fun too.)

However, I like rijp am waiting, but not just the PS3, but also the new Nintendo console which looks very promising. I don't know about you guys, but I don't intend to buy all three, and I want to get the one which has the best games (most fun) and, well, let's face it, the one which will have the best 'hacked' features. XBMC was the whole reason I got the intial xbox, not the games. Killer app indeed.

I'll just bash on Sony.

Actually, I won't, because I know it's easy now that if a product has the words "Sony" on it I will never purchase it. Process of elimination makes purchases that much easier.

"my impression is that even though PS3 will come out, it will be a "less powerful" machine than the xbox 360."

and what gives you that impression?

my money is waiting for the ps3,and
i'm going for a wii
lol

never liked the xbox, hardware or software.

OK, obviously you don't know how to read.

Look at the stats of the PS3. Then look at the games available for the XBox. Now look at the games available for the PS2, and PS3 will have a MUCH larger audience.

As for my credibility, ask me if I give a s***.

I don't come here to gain some peer review and expect you to give me some level of stature. I don't CARE. As for your comments about my knowledge, it doesn't matter what YOU believe, maybe you are like the other dimwits that have this tunnel vision of how things work.

Sony knows PS3 is going to be the XBox killer. Microsoft knows PS3 will make a serious dent in their sales. Why the hell do you think they pushed the XBox out so quick. They are HOPING to make enough waves that people will use it and therefore, they will gain a headstart, but it won't work.

Dreamcast got pushed out by the PS2, As did Saturn, and all the previous game consoles before PS2. PS2 hit the ground running, and it has , and still is a HUGE success, despite your knowledge of just how much foothold PS2 has and the PS3 WILL have.

You need to read the stats on the PS3 before you dispute my so-called "bias". Its not bias, you dweeb, its called research.

Tech specs, they will completely blow the Xbox away, video, speed, processor, memory. Yes, its more expensive, so what.

And, in case you haven't noticed there, Stevie Wonder, I give my OPINION. I don't care if you ASSUME I am giving a technical account of the issue.

you are entitled to dispute me, openly, that's WHY this forum is here in the FIRST place.

And where the hell are you comments, to contest my apparent bias? I don't see any comments from you, all of a sudden you blast me, because obviously you can't come up with opinions of your own, you just found 1 thing you don't agree with it, and now it gives you the ability to pretend I don't know what I am talking about.

As far as ignoring my comments, GREAT! I can't wait. If you dislike idiocy, then you probably should consider educating yourself, moron. It sounds to me like you are ignorant of this particular issue, so therefore YOU are the idiot not me.

Feel free to make some more comments as you see fit, so I can put you in your place again.

rijp -

It does not matter how well you word your comebacks and witty replies. The fact still stands.

Only an arrogant fool would expend their intellect by spouting the utter nonsense above; you have demonstrated with alarming aplomb your total lack of self perception in any way, shape or form.

For further proof- look at your first reply to me. If you truly had any character you would have conceded and respected my opinion, even if you differ with it - and do so respectfully.

But what did you do? Respond with an asinine and hostile rant about how right you are, and how wrong everyone else is. This really showcases how rattled you are at having read my post. Why? Because I put a mirror up to you and told you to look.

Since you are such a self described researcher,I will point you to a very well respected article on the architecture behind the Xenon [360] and Cell [Ps3]. The logical conclusion after looking at this data is that the playstation 3 and xbox 360 will actually be very close in both theoretical and actual performance. Translation? PS3 won't have substantially better looking games, and if they do, it will be well into the 2nd cycle of releases, thats right, sometime in 2007. That is a full 2 years after Xbox 360 will have been available, which by then will be well into it's Third generation of games.

Here is the article. Draw your own conclusions - http://arstechnica.com/a...aedia/cpu/xbox360-2.ars

Good day, sir.

What makes you believe the PS3 will be "be a less powerful machine than the xbox 360."???

The specs show the PS3 being either on-par or considerably more powerful than a 360 in all areas including feature set.

Because??? Actually Sony generally make very good products. The only person losing out, due to your personal crusade is YOU.

I doubt you will come back with how Sony products are DRM infected, yada yada yada, whilst forgetting that so is the competition (iPod, HD-DVD all have their fair share of DRM).

Oh, so what happened to ignoring my comments? Way to follow through there, jack ass.

Whatever, chow lame duck. What did you find the dictionary page, and decided you would try out the word of the day? How wonderfully sporting of you.

I don't care about character, this is a forum, not a popularity contest, you dork. Yes, I was hostile (but only on paper) you are not worth my time, and since the only thing you want to do is attack me, I suppose you missed that, huh?

I didn't say everyone else is wrong, you illiterate moron, I said *YOU* didn't do your research. Obviously you would rather have written, albeit losing, battle with me, than to simply look up the facts!

So you managed to find 1 website that supports your claim. Well hooray for you.

The games aren't even finished yet, mr. wizard, so how can we even compare content? The console is what the deal is here, not the software. Try to stay in context, ok? You keep getting moved by trying to impress everyone with your extensive vocabulary, but we are just not that impressionable.

Fine, you believe the XBox will be better than PS3, is that what I am seeing? You keep your pathetic XBox, and I will have my PS3. A year from now, then we will see who still believes they are true.

Sony has a larger, more extensive history than XBox. The proof is in the testing. The games and developers are going to dedicate more to the superior hardware.

Go to ANY gaming site. Look at the comparison between games, on Sony and Xbox. You will note that PS2 games rate higher than Xbox counterparts, and why is that? because the PS2 quality is better, not faster, but better.

So you go and doodle that on your etch-a-sketch.

I have to say first of all that chowmein's comments and argument are really eloquently expressed and I for one appreciate a open discussion. I am an xbox 360 fan which may be suprising because after the super nintendo I have only owned a playstation and playstation 2. I have to state that honestly while almost every article I've read has stated that actual performance between the 360 and PS3 will not vary greatly, theoretically it appears that the PS3 is more powerful and has the potential for the greatest performance visually. Last generation the xbox was noticably more powerful and for this reason alone that system was desirable. To say that there are many people who will not want to buy the PS3 for that reason alone (being theoretically more powerful than the 360) is to ignore common human reactions. On the other hand, to ignore a $600 price tag for a PS3 with complete HD functionality including HDMI output is foolishness too. To say that price does not matter or who cares is being unrealistic. Many people who are not among the wealthy will care. That price is simply too high to justify for many people when we all know per the laws of supply and demand in 2 or 3 years the price will drop by at least $100 or maybe $200 if Sony is not selling well, which honestly I don't see how it could. I have no doubt it will sell out during the holiday mania immediately following it's release, but by next summer Sony may find itself falling behind, especially if Microsoft is smart and either drops the better version of the 360 to $300, or builds in the HD-DVD drive to the $400 version.

I really think the 360 will perform well and am happy I guess because I am tired of Sony only releasing half the games for the U.S. that it does for Japan, and always 6 months to a year later. What's up with that? What about the fact that Japanese gamers have no respect for American made consoles and game studios evident by their unwillingness to give 360 the time of day. Microsoft seriously dropped the ball by not including roleplaying games in its launch day titles in Japan. Yet, let's be honest, there was already a bias against american systems before that blunder. I guess in the end I am for microsoft simply because they have forced sony to copy them in providing a simultaneous worldwide launch, thus giving Europe and the U.S. the respect they deserve. They have forced Sony to deal with a company that follows their same business practices of sign exclusive deals for top games which is how Sony beat out Nintendo last time and became the must console. Microsoft has forced competition on a video game market monopoly and if they can gain marketshare to control even 30-40% they will always remain a force to be reckoned with. If we believe that this competition makes products and companies better and promotes the inovation in games, controllers, and hardware that we all desire, how can we not root on microsoft. Because in the end, isn't that the American way!?

I believe Sony is capable of producing very good products--unfortunately, _IN MY EXPERIENCE, I have not encountered an exceptional product from Sony since my CD Player boombox purchased in 1994. It is the best I have ever encountered and I just cannot find one that compares in quality to that one.

The monitor I am using has the backlight shining on both sides...way to go Sony...

My DVD drive is crap, reads slow as crap and will need replacing soon, way to go Sony...

I sure as heck don't hink SOny makes great products. Oh did you buy any CDs last year, from Sony?

GENERALLY...

They also do some cheap and nasty products to compete at the lower end of the market. For example that cheap $60 VCR's

I have never suggest ALL products are the best around. You have to be selective.

Rijp,

Pay attention to what the big developers are saying, such as EA. EA have clearly stated that there is very little difference between the PS3 and the 360 in terms of performance, and the key differential is the dev tools supplied with the dev kits and according to EA and a number of other publishers and developers the better dev kit is on the 360.

In addition, your comments are partially true, the ps2 does have a larger user base and the ps3 will adopt this user base, however m icrosoft started with a 0% market share in the console market 6 years ago and now have a 40% market share. Sony should not be under estimated, but nor should microsoft, especially as they have more money to throw away at a project like this.

Moving on to what i think, well the 360 has established itself with a 3 region launch, a reasonable games list both full titles and arcade games. The ps3 has alot of potential as well, however i can't help but wonder what sony are doing, last year at e3 they slated microsoft for announcing 2 seperate skews, yet sony at e3 this year announced 2 skews. Sony have got gamespy to do their online networking aspect, but lets see now, gamespy do on-line networking for pc games... oh and pc games run windows wich is yet another microsoft product.

All in all its going to be a very close race this time, and lets not discount Nintendo just yet.

In a global marketplace, the "American Way" does not count for nowt.

YOUR SO WRONG. SO MANY OF THEIER PRODUCTS JUST PLAIN SUCK. You know dang well that sony makes POS products to rip the consumor off.

I usually agree with rijp, but on this topic it appears its just the opposite.

"Pay attention to what the big developers are saying, such as EA. EA have clearly stated that there is very little difference between the PS3 and the 360 in terms of performance, and the key differential is the dev tools supplied with the dev kits and according to EA and a number of other publishers and developers the better dev kit is on the 360."

Thats what makes me laugh at PS3 fanboys.

Say EA is working a game for the PS3 and xbox 360 right now (im sure they really are). The graphics they use for the PS3 are going to be the same ones they use on the xbox 360 (Im sure theyll be a bit lower for the Wii by looking at its stats but you never know) thus making both systems about equal in graphics. Same thing goes for performance.

well I don't remember where the quote "less powerful" came from, but I read it in some article where it mentioned that it had to do with IBMs cell tehchnology. as I said, it's an impression, but i'm waiting regardless...

dvferret,

I don't understand your comment... care to elaborate?

P.S. I'm not a fanboy of any kind, i currently own a ps2, xbox, 360 and a cube, in fact i am completely unbiased. Guess you have to be in my profession