MS to Fight Korean Antitrust Decision

By Ed Oswald, BetaNews

February 24, 2006, 11:11 AM

The South Korean Fair Trade Commission said Friday it would finalize its ruling that Microsoft engaged in unfair business practices, a charge the company vehemently denies. Microsoft has since vowed to appeal the ruling within 30 days, and may request a stay.

A preliminary ruling fined Microsoft $32 million in December, as well as ordering the company to unbundled its Windows Media Player and Messenger software from the operating system. Microsoft was also mandated to link to competing software.

Two separate versions of Windows would be offered in South Korea under the ruling: one minus Media Player and Messenger, and another with links to competing software as an option.

The Commission is planning for Microsoft to shoot back, and said in a statement that it was "fully prepared for an expected lawsuit."

Microsoft said in a statement that it believes the facts would show that the company has acted within Korean law, and its media player and instant messaging products within Windows are legal and have benefited Koreans.

It also pointed to new instant messaging services and media players that were "flourishing" within the country. Microsoft added that it had designed Windows to allow a consumer to be free to choose what messaging service and media player they wish.

"The facts do not support the Commission's position," the company said.
"If allowed to stand, this decision will have a negative effect on Korean consumers and Korean innovation." Microsoft added that it failed to see how consumers would benefit from the proposed new versions of Windows.

If the decision is allowed to stand, it would mark the second time in as many years that Microsoft would have been forced to substantially alter Windows to appease antitrust concerns of foreign governments. The company currently offers Windows XP 'N' in Europe, which stands for "not with media player."

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By Scipio

posted Feb 25, 2006 - 11:49 AM

I don't see why Microsoft has to change their OS for every country. It's not hard to use another media player or messenger.

And if you don't like Windows Messenger, try Doug Knox's MessengerDisable.exe. I used it to disable Messenger because I never use it, and disabling it helps Outlook Express to load much faster.

Score: 0

By Desides

posted Feb 26, 2006 - 4:24 AM

Way to fail to understand the legal concepts here.

Score: 0

By cranbers

edited Feb 25, 2006 - 5:14 AM

So if Microsoft is doing this all for the customer, ease of use all in one os etc. Why does MS need to "bundle it" as in bolt, chain, weld it into the operating system. Because really that is where the problem comes in. I hate all their crap, I just want to use the os to run my computer. Because well that is the only thing that is somewhat useful. The browser, media player, messenger, firewall, isp and everything else is just crap. yes there are competing products and I use them and they are much better. But why does microsoft make me unable to uninstall these malware's. It took the antitrust "punishments" if you want to call them that to give me the option to even "hide" them from view. Which is still broke because even if you do use the utility for that it magically pops up. so answer me those questions if I am being unresonable with my ranting. They did all this not for our benefit, paying customers but for their own monopolistic greedy behavior. They are all half baked, buggy bloatware. I mean how is it, that microsoft the most profitable company in the world next to exxon. Can have all the money in the world for R&D can be the most unimaginative company, have no inovation even though they claim to. They really were just in the right place at the right time and knew how to market their product. Thats it, linux is by far better then windows in almost every way and it's free. But they have the gaming community pretty much on lock down with directx as well as the hardware vendors with drivers. Who wants to program great easy to use drivers for an os that has 5 percent market share. So there is your problem and why ms is in the great position they are in. Now have all the Oem's on Microsoft's payroll which is essentially giving discounts on the products. Market your product so customers think they need windows and nothing else exists. Keep Oem's from providing a alternative os or cut them off from your product or raise the price for them. Thats all they have to do, the rest is history. I think as Linux really starts to get easier to use I mean it really already is but once gaming becomes main stream and better driver support Linux will be unstoppable.

Score: 0

By cranbers

edited Feb 25, 2006 - 5:03 AM

I also really like how microsoft is trying to argue that they did anything wrong, lets see I tie the browser to the os and I get punished, hmm let's try bundling media player and im's to the os now, oh im getting in trouble for that now too? What gives, oh I guess ill just bundle antispyware, widgets and desktop search to the os for my next release no doubt making them a aprt of the OS as well, does anyone smell multiple antitrust for vista? Oh I sure do. It's going to be an exciting next 5 years for microsoft, with 40 billion in revenue a year with 2 billion spent on legal battles mainly pay offs or shut up money. Why can't they just learn to at least pretend, to play nice with anybody. Because they don't have to they have enough money to pay off the courts I have no doubt that is what happend in 1998. I just wish they would have gotten broken up in that u.s. antitrust lawsuit. I really truely think we all will feel the pain forever in the I.T. due to that fall through. A perfect example is their lack of development with their os, and IE for the past 5 years they just plain have no one giving them a reason to strive for much of anything other then to pretend they are working on something good. It wasn't until firefox came about and started stealing market share and showing them up in that market they actually got off their lazy butt and started doing some work with the web browser and "inovating" or lack thereof. The sad thing is they are going to take credit for all the features that firefox includes and really made popular, tab browsing, css support to name a few. So congrats microsoft, you now have a new os coming out that looks and feels like Mac os x which has been out for years, and firefox which also has been out for years, buy out an anti-virus company and anti-spyware company for your new "inovative products for a couple of pennies that looks like you just came up with" and just steel everyone elses idea's put it in your own Operating system take your time designing and putting it out there 5 years thus far as a result stalling the entire industry from progress and reep the majority of all profits in the industry. So who here wants to bet Symantec, Mcafee all the other antivirus companies, all the pay for antispyware companies and firewall companies will start to fall off in the next 5 years like they never existed. Gee why is that, because microsoft is now entering all those domains, and tieing those products to the OS, with the exception for Antivirus, which is going to be Windows Live and a pay for subscription service. I hope Google and apple will stop them or at least slow them down with some real inovative products. Let's just hope google can keep up their pace and development progress and can really put out some products that will hurt Ms right where it counts, in the cash cow products.

Score: 0

By cranbers

edited Feb 25, 2006 - 4:55 AM

I don't think you all understand exactly what the problem is. Microsoft is pushing their own products unfairly on Windows customers. They cannot by antitrust law bundle products, with a monopoly product. A monopoly which you may not know is any product that has over 51 percent market share. When you are under a monopoly certain rules apply. Microsoft knows this and really doesn't care. No matter what the fine, penalty is they will still flurish untouched unharmed and unchanged. So by their very nature they will continue to do the same exact business practices, indefinetely. They are untouchable and that is just the way it is. Fining them will do nothing when it's a drop in a ocean worth of money to them. What they need to do is fine them a percentage of their worth, it should be like that for any fine for anyone. A 32 million dollar fine would destroy a lot of companies but for MS it wouldn't even make them blink. All these governments and courts can't all be wrong so there is obviously something wrong with MS practices.

Score: 0

By xyzcb1

posted Feb 24, 2006 - 3:40 PM

I really want to know if these anti-trust case is pro customer or just money?

You know what, I think the US DOJ should force all foreign cars maker to US engines on their cars

Score: 0

By eunichman

posted Feb 25, 2006 - 2:39 AM

lol, how little you know....
the us has for a long time required foriegn car manufacturers to bend over and take it up the pooper to sell cars in the US... not just special us only engines, but us only transmissions, brakes etc the list goes on and on, and then the us has the balls to charge these companies overseas who spend billions retooling to meet the outrageous demands of the us to pay unreasonably high taxes and tarriffs. who the hell does th us think they are?

Score: 0

By JacenSolo

posted Feb 24, 2006 - 8:16 PM

Just money.

Score: 0

By spiked

posted Feb 24, 2006 - 2:43 PM

I think Microsoft SHOULD offer a version of Windows which is pre-bloated with EVERY media player, toolbar, and other BS that Real, AOL, Google, Yahoo, Sun, etc. want to load. And every computer store in South Korea should be required to have two units of every model on display: one with the normal Windows and the one with bloated Windows next to it. I'm pretty sure that Koreans will figure out very quickly which computer they prefer.

Score: 0

By Das mod

edited Feb 24, 2006 - 11:29 AM

what the heck is wrong with korea :(
for as much as i hate to admit it .... any user with a version of XP "N" in their hands would ultimately end up installing WMP anyways ...
hello KOREA ... there's a feature called "remove components" ....
whats next .... they're gonna start asking food companies to start shipping their products "pre-chewed" .... or "pre-digested" ....
where did the concept of "do-it-yourself" go ???

if i ran microsoft, i'd retire my products from any country with silly complains like this ....

how'd you like them "no-OS-support" apples ???

Score: 0

By cranbers

edited Feb 25, 2006 - 5:44 AM

So tell me, why is there not a UNINSTALL feature? Are they afraid people will get it home and say geesh I don't want this crap uh, add/remove programs-uninstall-uninstall finish. ah thats better. oh wait I can't do that! Could that be a slightly strange antitrust worthy trick? Oh but did you know the add/remove components wasn't added until sp1? Well who do you think made them put that there. Also what do you think the os was like before it was there. Try installing real player, or kodak picture manager or netscape at the time. You had to start the programs up manually because any links, or double clicking of the file brought you directly to MICROSOFT's own product. with no choice if ands or buts about it. So answer that one. also do you honestly think ms would take their product out of a market for something so stupid, I bet they have the patch already in place to automatically remove those products for the os. I mean if you love media player, is that honestly what you use? If so have you tried any other products? Because I gotta tell ya no other company would get away with a piece of crap software like wmp 9 or 10 but when you bolt something to the os and give it no uninstall feature funny things happen. People get used to the idea and think oh well it came with the os, must be good enough for me. Oh it crashed or is hanging oh its taking up 60mb of ram, thats normal right?

Score: 0

By athome

edited Feb 27, 2006 - 12:39 PM

You don't need an uninstall feature, because you can configure it without one. I do not know of any program that you double click that it brings up a Microsoft product like you are describing. The only way in which that can happen is due to the way in which the person configured the product launch to begin with. At every step, a program asks what extensions you want to associate. Perhaps it is a user issue and not a Windows problem.

By default, the application you install takes the associated ext and binds it to its program. I have tried many other programs and have installed many programs for my customers that are non-MS and have never seen this program. To give you credit(small), I have seen it where someone has installed a 3rd party program to use for an ext(photo) but then wanted to use an MS product and the extension was changed back to that program due to its launch. But it asked, as many programs do, as to whether or not the user wanted the extension to be changed.

As for media player(which seems to be a lot of complaining by MS Bashers) if you install a 3rd party program like real, it still will not be able to play the ext that are copyrighted by MS and therefore, when these media types are clicked on will launch the default program which is MS Media player. This is not different than those programs like REAL or Quicktime - whom have specific ext for their players.

Only if a users computer is riddled with several media players, hacked software, and/or filled with adware/spyware programs does something like you are describing exist. You are iether a poor technician or a unknowledgable user. Read a few books like WindowsXP Step by Step, or WindowsXP Inside Out and you may understand what problems you have on your PC.

Score: 0

By fewt

posted Feb 24, 2006 - 6:11 PM

Maybe all the people that think MS can do no wrong are the ones that are actually wrong.

Now there's a thought!

Score: 0

By athome

posted Feb 27, 2006 - 11:37 AM

I don't think that MS Supporters are ones to even consider that they(MS) don't do anything wrong. In fact, they are more level headed in that they know that they don't do everything right(who does) unlike the bashers that think anything and everything they(MS) do is wrong.

Then some of the things that some complain about are just examples of individuals that don't understand what they are doing. I have seen computers with "several" messaging programs and media players installed. I see Dell, HP, Toshiba, and Sony just load program after program without any regard and this act causes problems(or adds to them).

I still feel that MS does a great job these days and there are many different programs I have loaded on over the years without any problems. They offer products on their OS that are not feature complete(very few), but do offer products via web or retail to purchase.

Score: 0

By fewt

posted Feb 27, 2006 - 12:42 PM

" I don't think that MS Supporters are ones to even consider that they(MS) don't do anything wrong."

Aren't they the ones that are now proclaiming that they haven't done anything wrong and they should "pull out of the EU"?

Now, I'm in the middle I don't warship them nor do I dislike them but that's just what you see here. ;-)

Score: 0

By madmike

posted Feb 24, 2006 - 12:10 PM

Its clearly a money thing, although agreed M$ is a monopoly, they get "stops" almost in every country, a true sign of success this is.

Score: 0

By athome

edited Feb 24, 2006 - 1:18 PM

Give them a Mac and they will be worse off yet! Where will they buy their products?

I do think that it is a joke. You can put on Windows anything you like(messaging or media). You can remove preferred application launches and set them at will. Consumers are getting an OS that can do almost anything right from the box. It doesn't come installed with MSN Messenger, or MS Office. All anyone has to do is buy what they want.

Another point is that all these features that these governments are asking for are preinstalled when you buy a Dell, HP, Toshiba, Sony, Gateway..... So what are they really after. Are these countries buying OEM software and building their own systems. Then if they are, they already know how to install what they want from the Internet.

They are just out to break up the Big-Bad-American-Microsoft and line their pockets like many other foreign nation leaders.

Score: 0

By cranbers

edited Feb 25, 2006 - 5:33 AM

You know Apple is also very greedy, but at least they inovate. If Apple opens up their OS and sells the it to OEM's in ms domain I have no doubt they will make a dent in MS market share even dell said they would sell it. They are stuck on being proprietary and that has been their down fall for the past few years. If it wasn't for the ipod they would have gone away a long time ago. The problem that Korea has with MS is tieing products to the core os and not offering a choice about it. When you start up media player and have itunes installed do they fight for rights to all your files they play? Same thing with the browser, of course you have to keep ie around for any kind of active x control program you might have anyway so yeah. Keep thinking it's all about money when companies are being destroyed because Ms can't fight on fair ground. It's like having an army firmly entrenched and here comes Ms with a Nuke in a surface to surface rocket coming to take you out. Can't do much to compete with that if your the company but you can try to get Ms's nuke taken away and make them invade instead. Even though they already launched and it's already too late, but there may still be time for a fighting chance. Just a thought.

Score: 0

By leriksen71

edited Feb 25, 2006 - 4:05 PM

Cranber's - I've never see so much hot air on a post.

What you want is 1)Microsoft to suddenly and rapidly implode or be destroyed, 2) to have ALL the financial and personel assets redistributed to the companies you favor, 3) possibly prop up a company such as Apple to take Microsofts place.

Here are some other points:

1) You act like the MS .net framework doesn't exist. You make no mention about the forth coming WinFx products. But I'm sure you would dismiss them is slow, backwards and stupid with out a technical overview. Never mind that ASP.net or the Mono variant could clean up PHP (yes - PHP in it's native distro is slow) and compete with and surpass JSP.

2) You seem to think that a consumer desktop experience should be just like a linux desktop experieince. But good grief, if a consumer is 'forced' into using instant messenger becasue they are to stupid or ignorant to go get AOl or what ever then that's the consumers problem. If it wasn't provided, they would fall behind Apple with IChat. Just out of curriosity, can one remove IChat or quicktime from OS X. Or is the reality that Quciktime is a foundational media component on in OS X and cannot be removed? Let me know.

3) Yep. Your right on with IE. They have neglegted it badly and they made a big mistake in the IE 4 time line. However, you're not giving the credit for improving the rendering engine and severly locking down IE in Vista.

Look we could go on here. The bottom line is that you're exposing a double standard. You would love to have all that cash flow into a select set of companies, those that you deem worthy, to move their products forward for your benifit. You would like consumers to have the bewildering experience of breaking software and incompatibility due to absolute middleware removal. (That might be good for a server but it doesn't work the same for a consumer desktop). You would also like to see MS only be able to bundle worthless products and force them to advertise for their competetors. Odd, in the internet era with more information out there than you can shake a stick at your claiming 'poor, ignorant consumer'. The only good point you make is on IE and everybody and their dog agrees. You claim they haven't done anything with their OS in 5 years but you claim that Vista/Longhorn Server only meerly looks like OS X and that's about it.

And just for fun, how could Google stop or slow down Microsoft? Seriosuly now, they are a web advertising and app provider. They have no platform. Apple is the only serious competator and real inovator here, but they cut their own throat and are just know recovering. The move to x86 and x64 will be very big and sets them up to be more competative. The biggest problem that people have is in move to the mac is that they don't want to throw away their apps - where all the money is really invested - if you actually by software. Having an x86 capable machine makes that move a LOT easier. It also makes it a lot easier if they choose to allow OSX to invade the general PC space. That's welcome from my point of view.

Score: 0

By cranbers

posted Feb 25, 2006 - 8:07 PM

In regards to google, yeah your right they are a advertisment company, but if you look around the web, who is microsoft most worried about. Google, look up google and microsoft in the same search and you will get a whole lot of listings. Things such as employees fleeing ms to go work for them etc. They are the only company really doing a good job of inovating. They have a lot of power and are earning respect. They have a revenue stream that microsoft cannot stop through traditional methods, and as the famous words of steam ballmer, ill F****** bury google! so now there is my point, if they come out with a linux distro or something similiar and an office suite which is web based. Give it away for free, they can beat them right where it counts and that is in their huge cash cows, and manage it through their revenue stream. so yeah maybe you didn't think of that. In regards to everything else your points were well, not very well taken. IE and their desktop was just an example. if you have a death grip on the industry where will your competition come from. Some people who don't know better seem to think, oh well if the products were better from other companies then they would be on top. But it's like having a 800 pound gorilla going against a house cat. Not to mention Linux, who knows what their install base really is, there is no way to tell with free downloads, and free installation. The problem is when you have thousands, maybe even millions of people and companies using the linux install base it's nearly impossible to make a profitable company that can compete with microsoft on their own grounds and on the home desktop which ms has a death grip on. Now what linux could do to become more successful, come out with a marketing blitz, educate consumers that there is an alternative, get the oem's on board, key players would be hp, dell and gateway. Then maybe we will start to see linux start to take over and get some good press. Well then you have to get the gaming community on board, and go back to opengl instead of directx, yeah there is more to it then originally thought.

Now in regards to mac os x, well let's see they have a 2 percent market share, which makes the antitrust laws not apply in the first place, so they can do that. Then figure otu that hey apple does actually care about their products and inovation. There browser is actually pretty cool and most of the operating system features are cool as well and actually useful.

Do I want all the money to go to companies I like, well if they deserve it sure I do. Does microsoft deserve or earn the profits they reep? I think not, do I pay for any ms products, nope I don't. I use open office, firefox and itunes. I also use xp which came from a oem. have I bought a ms product in the past sure, I bought Windows ME, which should be an antitrust lawsuit in itself for being such a piece of crap. Do I know much about programming to reply to your .net comments, no not really. But I know I read some stories about .net, like steve ballmer didn't even know what it was and the whole idea of .net has been almost a complete failure.

So tell me are you one of Ms's pr people trying to put the facts straight because, you know I didn't even see one argument. You actually defended most everything I said. Now yes under the hood changed in Vista is a good thing the security lacking which should have a nice band aid over it in vista should be better. But let's see what did ms promise in early development for longhorn and just with their billions of dollars in profit couldn't deliver because, well let's face it. They have no reason to invoate or live up to anything they promise. I would like to argue that Ms, has a duty as being the greater then 90 percent holder in a industry to do good things, instead they steel ideas, crush the competition with brute force and starvation. You can't really argue with that, you can say well that is capitalism and the world in which we live, but it doesn't make what I say not true, it maybe less painful to just not think of it in such context but well I do. I hate the fact that they can do nothing and still make billions. They have no incentive to do anything well, because they have no worries that their market share or profit margin will be affected. let' see over the past 5 years they have done nothing with their os, except for apply bug patch after security patch after patch. Their excuse is, they are the target because they are the most popular os, well if you have billions, why can't you put some security guys in to actually fix the bugs before they are discovered, why do you release a product that has bugs in the first place. It's called beta testing and microsoft says oh it's stable, put it ou, sp1 will be started on day 1 it's shipped.

Score: 0

By athome

edited Feb 27, 2006 - 12:35 PM

MS is not concerned about Google, but they are a competitor to them. It is only wise to be aware of what they do. MS has only been an OS and they are breaking into other technologies as would anyone else(and they are). There are many companies joining forces to produce the next wave of Internet interactive software. However, no OS as of yet. It will continue to be years for that to happen and it will be a slow pace. Hence, MS even changing from what they have done for so long. But, you cannot expect MS to lay back and wait for others to play catchup either. They need to keep moving forward as companies do. They are working with many others on that front.

Score: 0