DVD9 is better than any of these formats.
DVD9 with H264, oh yeah!

Although I am indifferent to this battle between HDDVD & BluRay, I must say this is an interesting turn of events; I mean Sony finally winning this war. It means that history really is NOT doomed to 'repeat itself' after all! I thought that this was actually gonna be a do-over of what happened with Beta, which everyone knows was a superior format that of VCR, and yet it was crushed anyway.

Oh well Sony can suck my testi-satchel for their crap pro-DRM attitude and the recent rootkit fiasco but you know what? F*ck it, good for you Sony as BluRay was really a better technology anyway......

I'd say overall HD-DVD probably dropped out at the best time.
Still, I hoped it could've lingered longer so it would lower then prices of Blu-rays.
They're still a bit more expensive than I'm happy with.

I'm glad the war has finally been decided but a few points to consider are:

As Sumner Redstone's famous quote goes 'content is king'. In the same way Super Audio CD's and DVD audio didn't acquire mainstream market adoption. Will people rush to Blu-Ray or just continue to download more and more content in Divx format in the same way people obtain mp3's..? The ability to have high quality doesn't mean people will make the effort to obtain it.

Copying - Like it or not, having the ability to make copies does fuel the adoption of this type of technology. Constantly locking down content makes people less likely to jump to the technology in the first place.

Sony - Having Sony at the head of this new generation of content system is not something I'm looking forward to. Its track record has not been the best over the past few years. Now the competition has been removed, what’s the alternative if they fire up the rookits and spyware again?

Nate Mook's delusional HD DVD fanboyism is the laughing stock of the internet.

http://forums.highdefdig...e0fb0c81e55&t=44371

http://forums.highdefdig...e0fb0c81e55&t=38948

Hmmm and your vitriolic spite and malice is nothing to be proud of either mate.

Had Toshiba not forced Sony to rush an unfinished product to market by creating HD-DVD then Blu-Ray probably never would have seen the light of day and the only source for HD movies would have been on cable or satellite TV. Blu-Ray was years away from release before Toshiba released their HD-DVD format.

no that would be you Dave

yea the blu-ray group at CES pointed at the HD-DVD group as to why blu-ray was rushed out the door

probably pointed like a 10 year old

rofl
Since when was the 'internet' a bunch of tru blu people on a forum?

You just became the laughing stock of betanews with that ridiculous accusation. Humor of the day

And since your eyesight seems to be shot you should have noticed that this story on this page has nothing to do with nate.... Nice Article Scott :)
That makes you a troll!! Congratulations!!

Perfectly stated. All the more reason why is is so upsetting to see the inferior, unfinished format win this "war". Sad.

Horray!!! Now Lets aim those sites on the extremely overpriced Blurays and get back to the business model that has been proven for years and years and has ZERO reason for disappearing, considering they are efficient to make, cheap to own, and machine are downright cost effective to upgrade with an upscaler built in... DVD.

DVDs are fine. Blu-rays (like HD DVD) are the premium discs for people who want the premium version, and will probably be priced accordingly. However, as take up goes up, price will drop, just like DVD was when VHS was the norm.

I can agree with that :)
However I do note that there is still premium priced dvd's on the market :(
Those normally s*** me off too and I wont buy them.

i still have transformers on hd and a cheap upconverter. i wont be upgrading to a bluray player. i'll probably get an apple tv. apple i like, it's cheaper than a bd player, it already has full industry support, and it doesnt have a 2 minute startup time. wee!

as a bonus it's 1/10th the size :D

Well Sony blu-ray products just went up more.I wonder if they have the second generation firmware sorted out for the ps3 Hmmmm. Nows the time MS should move forward and take on sony its there for the grabs now. and as for cheaper media Ha! see what sony does for you the consumer http://www.accc.gov.au/c...dex.phtml/itemId/322787 also this http://www.reuters.com/a...olt/idUST28617520080220 And who really cares as we read this the movie companys are setting up direct streaming and digital downloads for your TV Computer and Ipods and eventually gaming consoles. so do you ask yourself is there going to be disks of any color soon? Just look at technology so did sony do themselves justice, only for a short while I think

Is that an attempt to bash sony?
That also includes universal & Warner..

Not at all in fact been doing a lot of research (Trust me) and in my opinion only sony does not favor (us) the consumer just dont forget the failure of SACD just my opinion please dont take it personally

Maybe come back to us at the end of the day and see if the media is more expensive. Somehow I don't think you will be able to.

I say congratulations to Sony & Blu Ray, do whatever you have to win is my motto. Toshiba didn't do enough to seal the deal, Warner was the key, obviously.

Netflix will see a surge in rentals, which is the best way to go for everyone as most of the movies today arent worth purchasing.

Sony's next move will have to convince the remaining 99.5% of the public to buy BD and get rid of standard DVD.

I still say HD formats are not a big enough jump from standard DVD to convince most people. We watched Rattatoule on the projector / screen upscaled the other night, it looked phenomenal.

HD-DVD should stick around as a data format for archiving HD home movies / recordings etc...

The good news, I'm buying every discounted HD-DVD I can get my hands on. Hopefully they will be under ten bucks.

--------------

I'll even be the better man and say congratulations to Benjamin / Dave. Your character is shown by your actions, this place will stink of his farts for a long time as he gloats.

I still say HD formats are not a big enough jump from standard DVD to convince most people.
and we all know how well your 'predictions' have been...

we all know that is not a prediction, its evident right now.
That's not to say it wont change sometime in the future. Blu-ray has a lot of positive publicity recently.

Whats the matter dlab? Bitter? Angry? Broke? Relax, it's only a format. Find something more important to worry about than this crap like what you will be doing for retirement money.

You have to give them a Thumbs Up for a good effort. I own a PS3 and a couple BR Movies, but unlike most, I waited to see which format would win until I bought.

The PC3's XMAS 2007 sales are what pushed this. 1.2 Million PS3 (BR Players) sold and that is a MAJOR indication on how the movie studio's would go.

PS3 is a Media Center that is still evolving. It is still the cheapest BR Player on the Market and the fact that is is a Game and Media Console, it is the smartest choice.

I know I sound like a PS3 Fanboy, but I am not really. It just made sense for this format to progress.

I still think the format can be used in the IT / Tech world. Still a good Storage / Backup media.

"PS3 is a Media Center that is still evolving. It is still the cheapest BR Player on the Market and the fact that is is a Game and Media Console, it is the smartest choice."

I understand many people feel that the PS3 simply is the best option on the market but not everyone thinks that way.
Many for example know the playstation name as a gaming console and one that has proven its worth over time. The idea of having it as a blu-ray player isn’t that attractive to someone who has zero interesting in gaming. I doubt the thought would have even crossed their mind.
What would a salesman say if someone said they were looking for a blu-ray player? Should they recommend a playstation? Surly not. They would offer the customer several solutions.
I know you said yourself you are not a ps3 fanboy and I accept that because of the effort and sense you put into your post instead of bashing and throwing insults around. But that said there are those here that just preach PS3 PS3 PS3 and just cant understand there is more to blu-ray than their precious investment.

And so it begins.... the blu-ray fanbois are measuring their weenies against the HD-DVD fanbois over something they really had NO hand in accomplishing or "winning".

Simply put, the following can be said after reading this long line of trash...

First: Not everyone wants/needs a game console to play movies, and to say that "all you need is a PS3" is total bularky, my Grandmother, Dad and my Mom don't want a PS3 because they don't do console games, and probably neither do yours, so who gives a flying patoot over the PS3. Standalone players will always be preferred by most people for playing their HD media, not a video game console. I'm not spending 3-500+ for a player, and neither should you.

Second, some people would rather see CHEAPER pricing on players, and as such HD movies are going to stay a niche market. WHO CARES? Until a final finished spec is out in *affordable* players all over the *world*, it's going to be a niche market, and will stay that way. Again, price is going to decide if blu-ray lasts. If no one buys the format because the players are all buggy and the "only" player available is a video game console, people are going to drop the format and wait for something else, like downloadable HD.

Third: Yes, people, Sony is evil. Yes, let me reiterate: SONY IS EVIL. WHO FREAKIN' CARES?!? Anyone who's bought one of their rootkitted CD's or played an MMO of theirs (EQ/EQ2/SWG to name a few) or bought one of their formats (Like we all didn't see UMD and MiniDisc for the money-sucking Media-Company DRM friendly attempted exclusivity stupidity it was) would know that already, and really shouldn't argue that fact at all. So don't expect the price of Blu-Ray tech to drop below 150 bucks *ever*. There won't be a price war, because Sony always puts out overpriced proprietary junk. (Vaio, anyone?)

Toshiba's lost this round. WHO CARES!?! It was bound to happen that Sony would eventually win a format war. The sun shines on a dog's arse some days too, ya know.

Sure, I expected HD-DVD to win simply by the merits of that they had a cheaper, consumer friendly, feature complete spec on the market a *year* earlier than Blu-Ray. That should have won the war for them, but that doesn't always happen.

Capacity on movie discs means nothing to most people, and it shouldn't matter to you either, because in the end, it's about the movies, not the extras. 9 out of 10 people (probably even lower ratio than that) will say they buy a disc for the movie and not the extras.

And if you say "Blu-Ray looks better than HD-DVD on screen", then you're smoking a big crack pipe, and need to put it down and exhale deeply. They both were IDENTICAL to the human eye. Internal bandwidth numbers on the players mean nothing to the masses, all they want is to see the movie and see the clarity. That's *it*. They're not going to get into arguments over how their player is better because it does a few megabits better transfer rate internally. Woopty freakin DOO!

Blu-Ray simply out-marketed, and out-backroom-dealed HD-DVD. Like the Beta/VHS war, the better format didn't win. Big woop.

Get over it, and move on.

Like all this gibberish that you just said matters anymore. Spoken like a true DUD.

Move on. Get yourself a PS3 and enjoy hidef the way it should be.

See, spoken like a true Blu-Ray fanboi...

I don't need a piece o-S 3... I don't do console games. Why do I need a console gaming platform to play videos?

PS3 is more than just a game console. It's a very fun machine which happens to bundle bluray in it. For the same price that you are going to pay a standalone bluray player, you can get yourself a PS3 which is by the way, 2.0 ready. If you want to wait, the prices of these BD players will definitely come down. For how much? I don't know but definitely cheaper than the present.

Bitter much?

Those that supported Blu-Ray did have a hand in accomplishing the fall of HD-DVD. They were part of the larger of the two consumer bases. They purchased Blue Ray players (including the PS3) and Blue Ray disks. To discount that installed base led to the abandonment of the HD DVD format by the majority of the Media Companies and eventually Toshiba is to be naive of business and economics.

Second, where is your proof that "9 out of 10 people (probably even lower ratio than that) will say they buy a disc for the movie and not the extras." Because quite frankly 90% of figures posted on the 'net are made up (and yes mine was too).

Interesting that you compare this to Beta/VHS alluding to the fact that Beta was better format. Ironic that it was back by the same Evil Corporation you lambasted above.

I think that you will find the average consumer could really care less about all the "extra" stuff it can do. Just make a player that is complete and just plays movies end of story.

Frankly I like what the PS3 can do but the vast majority I bet would find the thing scary. They want simple and cheap end. Sony needs to get the specs final and machines out right away. No more delays no more excuses. I don't understand why so many of you do not understand that people will see the PS3 as a game system. That alone will turn some off. My dad for example will see playstation and give it a pass. The name tells everything. Playstation has become a household name for a game system for a long time.

I hear you there. But in defense of the PS3, as I have previously mentioned, its more than just a combo machine. So far, it is one of the few (if not the only one) that is 2.0 ready and the price is not that bad now (compared to its release last year or so). Its just because they name it Playstation 3 doesn't mean that it can only do games. Consoles these days, like PS3 and Xbox 360, are not just for games anymore. You can browse the net, download stuff, etc.

That is not what I mean. I think that many or a very high percentage of consumers see the PS3 as a game machine not for what it really is. People that don't play games see the name and move on. I also agree that the system can do lots of cool things but I think that many just want to be insert a disk and away they go. I know that the PS3 will do just that but as I stated before the average joe does not. Blu needs to get a stand alone player out that is a final spec for your average buyer right away. The ball is rolling fast don't loss the momentum with a profile problem. People will hear about the profile issue and not understand what it about and simply stay away. Benny and the others may flame about that but that is reality. Make it so right away. I hope that clears up my statement a little better.

Clear. :-)

"Sure, I expected HD-DVD to win simply by the merits of that they had a cheaper, consumer friendly, feature complete spec on the market a *year* earlier than Blu-Ray. That should have won the war for them, but that doesn't always happen."

"Capacity on movie discs means nothing to most people, and it shouldn't matter to you either, because in the end, it's about the movies, not the extras. 9 out of 10 people (probably even lower ratio than that) will say they buy a disc for the movie and not the extras."

So in the first paragraph quoted you say HD DVD is "feature complete" while in the second paragraph quoted you say that 9 out of 10 people won't buy it for extras. Contradicting yourself there, aren't we, seeing as the newer Blu-ray profiles only add extras?

Feature complete means:

Spec was hammered out and implemented in the hardware/player before it hit the market, i.e. HD-DVD didn't have to go through "profile" revisions like BR did.

Heck, even the first gen BR players didn't have the capabilities that the HD-DVD players did, like ethernet, updating through the internet, etc.

To me and a lot of other people, that's exactly what the PLAYstation 3 is... a GAMING platform.

When I think of a movie player, I think of a dedicated device that it's only function in life is that it plays movies, like a DVD player.

A PS3 is a gaming console with multimedia capabilities. I don't need to spend the extra $ for that. I just want a player. That's why I have such a big problem with Sony trying to push this ginormous expensive device when a simple disc player will do quite nicely.

Yes, Beta was a better product by it's technical merits, but mainly was beat out because a) VHS came out at least 2 (I may be underestimating that number, it might have been more) years earlier than Beta, and b) VHS had a longer playing time and was cheaper to manufacture.

If you remember, Beta had stereo audio and better resolution than VHS for a while until there were refinements done to the VHS format to allow hi-fi audio and dolby surround.

But up until a few years back, Beta still survived because the broadcast industry used it. Camera people didn't need the extended capacity of VHS and were satisfied with the 1 to 2 hour capacity of the Beta tapes to be "masters" to work from.

It was technically the superior format, but again, that proves the case that better doesn't always win.

And the people who made Blu-Ray "win" were the ones working the back door industry deals, the ones that designed and endorsed the studio-friendly and anti-consumer DRM (whee, managed copy eliminated, and repeat buying when you want to placeshift those blu-ray movies to a portable media device, score one for the studios!), the marketing folks that flooded every dvd commercial with their moniker, and the industry reps who convinced short circuit and worst buy to push the higher-margin blu-ray players and PS3 gaming platform.

The HD player market is too niche right now to even think that the consumer was the one who influenced or decided the outcome.

"And the people who made Blu-Ray "win" were the ones working the back door industry deals, the ones that designed and endorsed the studio-friendly and anti-consumer DRM "

Hmmm, I wonder why a company would have a desire to protect their investments. Is it anti-consumer? I tend to agree with you. I bought the disk and should have the ability to use it within existing fair use laws. This may bite them in the end. But, it is still not shocking for them to attempt to control distribution of their product.

"the marketing folks that flooded every dvd commercial with their moniker "

The reason there was more commercials for blue is because 3 out of the 5 media companies used that format. It is simple math man. The majority of the content providers were producing them in that format.

"... and the industry reps who convinced short circuit and worst buy to push the higher-margin blu-ray players and PS3 gaming platform."

"The HD player market is too niche right now to even think that the consumer was the one who influenced or decided the outcome."

Bawhahaha. While I agree it is still a niche market. There were measurable numbers over the time both formats have been available to consumers. The most certainly showed a s*** in units sold (both hardware and software) to Blue Ray. Was this partly due to consumers seeing the writing on the wall due to Warner, Net flicks, et al abandoning the format? Certainly, after those announcements were made. There is no reason to stay with a sinking ship. But, quite frankly those companies still had to review marketing analysis to determine if this is the correct business decision for them. The trend appeared before that just on a much smaller scale.

And regarding Beta/VHS. Blue Ray is still the technologically superior format due to capacity whether you wish to admit it work not. In your example with beta/VHS you indicated that Beta had was technologically superior due to it's video resolution and audio quality. Capacity was one of VHS' edges, as you indicated. And we know the outcome of that.

In this format war, the two were indistinguishable in video and audio output. The difference came down to cost and capacity. Which of those two distinctions is a technical one?

Sorry, for snipping up your post but, it was one run on sentence with several disparate points. I don't usually like to break down post point by point but, it was the only way I could address each of them in a contextual manner.

And in a later statement in your post, you say that 9 out of 10 people won't care for the extra features. Seeing as the newer profiles only add extra features (and not exactly features that are essential to it anyway), it's not going to matter, is it? Your post simply contradicts itself.

Actually, Betamax was launched 1 year earlier than VHS. Other than that, your post is a good one.

Well, that wasn't too painful, now, was it?

How long did the video tape format war last? A long time, from what I recall...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Videotape_format_war

First of all: WAY TO GO BLU RAY!!!!

Second, finally, the war is officially over. We can now all move on with one, and ONLY one hidef media. As I have said several times on this forums here, in which some of you have flamed me on, BD IS the successor over DVD. Nothing that you HD DVD campers can say now will matter anymore. Your boss from Toshiba have spoken and recognized that enough is enough. You should all do the same and start looking forward on how we can all unite and use BD. It's not the end of the world. You will still continue to pay your bills and all is well with your friends and family. Stop the false commentators about how HD DUD will-still-be-better gibberish as it will no longer fly anymore, anywhere.

Let's move on....towards a BLU world.

"As I have said several times on this forums here, in which some of you have flamed me on, BD IS the successor over DVD."

You have been flamed on that, because as of right now and for the foreseeable future it is not true. Simply because Blu-ray has emerged victoriously from the battle with HD DVD, it does not make it the successor to DVD by default. It now has an entirely different battle... one that actually means something for a change.

Guess I'll grab a HD-A31 asap (and cheap) so I can have a decent player for the remainder of the life of my existing HD discs.

Thanks god. Maybe we can turn our attention/quibbles to other technology hardly anyone is using now.

*LOL* Thanks for the chuckle.

The Blu-Ray factories are partying today.

No, I'm pretty sure the people making Blu-Ray players in sub-par conditions for sub-par wages aren't looking forward to increased production... ;)

Very true...

A moment of silence please for those slaving away manufacturing feature-crippled standalone Blu-ray consoles that should never have been built to begin with.

Talk about a thankless job.

But a big pat on the back to all the little chinese people making their HD player for peanuts ...

Hip Hip !!

It wouldn't make sense for Toshiba to keep developing HD-DVDs for PCs given the limited portability of the format. What are you going to do with the discs now that the format is dead? In terms of backup storage, capacity is king.

It could work though. They could keep on developing the 3-layer 51GB disc they said the DVD Forum had approved.

Read the Toshiba press release.

http://hddvd.highdefdige...leasetoshiba021908.html

Oh... they threw in the towel COMPLETELY. Pity, I assumed they only canned the development of HD DVD as movie discs.

Oh... you didn't read the press release COMPLETELY. Pity.

...yet will continue to make efforts to meet customer requirements. The company will continue to assess the position of notebook PCs with integrated HD DVD drives within the overall PC business relative to future market demand.

I stand corrected. Thanks.

Yes that paragraph seems to throw a lot of things off around the place.
I'm confused by it as well as it does not = completely dropping hd-dvd yet they state they have.

There are some people on this site eating their words right now.

And probably crying as they lay alone in the basement.

Amen!

All negative and pessimistic comments are from XBOX and HD-DVD owners and people who can't afford it right now and people who have no interest anyways.

UNIVERSAL GOES BLU!!!!!

That didnt take long.

http://www.highdefdigest...__Studios_Goes_Blu/1483

And that came as a surprise ?

All you have to do now is convince everyone to ditch DVD, and go blu ... Good luck with that. Don't expect any help from china.

Now we just need Universal and Paramount release dates!!!

Hopefully Paramount will release a statement soon.

1 million HD-DVD players compared to over 10 million Blu Ray players on the market?
Toshiba and Microsoft KNEW at black Friday time that HD-DVD was going to be extinct, and they still fooled people into buying their product.

From Thanksgiving they knew their product was out the door.

I don't care about everyone. Only myself and my products. I'll buy what I think is affordable, and rent from Netflix.

At least I have a choice! We Blu ray adopters who did our research instead of buying a cheap player on black Friday can now buy what we want when we want. Can HD-DVD people say that? NOPE.

In other news, water is wet...

Seriously, with Toshiba retiring HD DVD, what other choice did they have?

Of course not the company wants to make money. I would think that Para will respond the same way shortly. There is no need to delay. Once Toshiba quit both were effectively released from their contracts. I hope Para will get to work on the Star trek disks right away. They did an excellent job on the HD ones look, forward to the next ones on blu.

Had nothing at all to do with research. If you adopted early and wanted Universal titles in HD you bought HD. No one knew how long the battle would go on. If you had the money for both formats buy them.

I like your admitting to being self centered.

we might be screwed on startrek for awhile since toshiba was the one paying for it to be remastered

"Toshiba and Microsoft KNEW at black Friday time that HD-DVD was going to be extinct"

You left out your insightful source for this.

I await it eagerly

Well, it looks like the bickering can finally stop and we can all ease into the glorious world of high-definition videos and the like.

Wait, what am I saying? This is the Internet!

"Viva Blu-Ray" eh? What is this, a revolution?

I'm not planning on going high-definition any time soon (being a college student really leaves one without much disposable income), so I didn't particularly care which format came out on top in this case. Yes, I'm slightly affronted by the fact that the region-coded version backed by Sony "won," but in the end I just don't care: Riding two horses around the race track is never a smart idea; sticking with one strongly increases your chances of success.

Good points The rest of us who don't have a huge cash flow have no interest in pursuing this venture. People keep posting about how intelligent the conversations are in regards to this topic. I am just sick of the Sony fanbois and their propaganda spreading B.S. I would like to make my own choices subjective or objective its my choice to try and sell me on your format when I have seen the black print and read through the lines.

I am happy with my up converting player and DVD suits me just fine.
Bloray can burn in the depths of hell for the time being.

You are lucky that you are a college student! By the time you can afford stuff like this, the TV's and Blu Ray players will be very cheap.

I wish I had waited before buying my first HDTV. I missed HDMI by about 3 months.

Oh well.

Wow.
I also enjoy my upconverted DVD's on my player that converts as best it can, depending on how well they made the original DVD.

Oh, I also enjoy the blu ray videos that I can play.

Oh,I also enjoy streaming pictures, music, and videos from my computer to my blu-ray player.

Oh, I also enjoy streaming pictures, music, and video from the internet to my blu-ray player.

Can your up converting player do that?

Your choice has been made for your. DVD's, up converted DVD's, or Blu Ray.

What did I say? What did I say? If you read my past posts, you'll know.

Enough said.

Just so you know, with no competition now blueray players and movies will only go up in price, including the PS3. They definitely won't lower them at this point. All you blueray fanboys rejoice, your precious format war is over. Find something else to whine about.

You are so wrong!!!

Viva Blu Ray!

Of course they will lower prices! There is something called "Supply and Demand" that helps regulate prices.

Look it up!

Yeah, cos of course there isn't several manufacturers competing for consumer's wallets. skuz440's comments are completely uneducated, obviously.

Funnily enough DVD seems to have done well despite no competition. And Blu-ray will now be competing with them, if they want to replace DVD entirely.

And if HD DVD won, the situation would've been the same!

Great somebody won. Now all we need is to see player run under $100 and get into the hand of the mass. I doubt it it will ever happen especially when it's from Sony. Or maybe VOD will remove physical disc from the market in the next few years.

Good thing Blu-ray's patents aren't held solely by Sony then.

Also good that they aren't the only ones making players too.

I look forward to seeing $100 Blu-ray players at some point in the future.

I think there will be cheaper blu ray players. Samsung is working on it.

But why buy one when you can get a PS3?

A PS3 does way more than just play games.

I love streaming music, pictures, and videos from my home computer to my PS3.

I love using my PSP to talk to my PS3 and watch and listen to whatever I do have on my hard drive on my PS3.

TVersity works great on my PS3. (As it does on XBOX 360)

Netflix is going to offer VOD to PS3 and XBOX360 users.

Firmware updates are constantly coming to the PS3.

The PS3 keeps winning awards from non-gaming sites for its audio and visual capabilities.

The PS3 is already 2.0 compliant.

Soon the European market can use the PS3 as a DVR. Hopefully that will come to the U.S. market.

I fought in the format wars, and won!

I'd like to stand up an applaud Toshiba for not dragging this out till the bitter end...Toshiba has made a choice in the interest of the consumer, and HD Media in general...they realize that one unified format is best for the consumer, and the industry as a whole...

whether you supported BD or HD-DVD it is now time to move forward...this format war was stupid in the first place, but it did have a great effect on price. I don't think either side would have dropped prices as quickly had there been no competition, and for that i am thankful...

HD Media will grow, and will eventually surpass SD-DVD in sales just as SD-DVD overtook VHS (it took 7 years remember)...prices will come down over time (DVD players were just as expensive relative to inflation when it was released) and now that there is a single format there is no need to choose sides and pick what movies you want to see...

My GOD. An intelligent post! Rare to see here.

Now I can agree with you.

Now they only need to kill DVD.

Oh crap. Can't believe it all came crashing down so fast.

Dammit. I really thought we wouldn't have to invest in another, inferior technology so soon. Saying that, I will go blue in the face before I buy a blueray player or movies...

Goodbye HDDVD. You will be sorely missed.

why? you make no sense....embrace the winning format....just as blu ray supporters would have done if HD-DVD had won....

Obviously it's your choice and no one can force you, but only an idiot would refuse to buy a format just cos they were a fan of the format rival.

yes but if hd-dvd had one the blu group would have only had to make a small investment for a finished player some of us are a bit bitter because we don't want to pay $400 for a player with unfinished spec's (ps3 and 360 don't work for me they are both to dam ugly)

Unfinished spec? I think you'll find that the player will play all discs regardless. The extra features are just that, extra features, that aren't essential anyway.

The extra features are just that, extra features, that aren't essential anyway.

I love that excuse. Absolutely love it.

It's pathetic, dismissive, and brilliantly elitist, which pretty much describes the whole BD crowd to a tee.

If you say it isn't so, then it isn't so? Yeah...that only works for God.

And it's amazing that you can't see it for what it is. Unlike you who has to nit pick over every tiny feature and trumpet some minor advantage as some amazing thing that proves it's so so so much better than the competition, I just sit back, analyse and determine if it really actually matters, much like the general public in fact.

Sounds like YOU are the elitist one here. Maybe even a bit of a tech geek. The rest of us in the real world will simply get on with our lives.

*laughing*

No, the "real world" doesn't give two s***s about HD, genius.

The rest of us are actually intelligent enough to see how asinine "no-one's going to use it anyway" is.

Ya'll keep trumpeting it like it's the second coming, but when we point out that many stand-alones can't handle the interactivity you turn around and claim no-one will use it.

It's like you're related to Hilary Clinton or something...

So which is it? Awesome feature confirming the "superiority" of Blu-Ray, or something no-one will use?

The interactivity with the special features is part of what makes HD DVD and blu-ray a 'next-gen' movie experience. So yeah...they're kind of essential to the overall picture.

And if they're so unimportant, and so many people won't use them, why has the BDA been playing catch-up with HD DVD? First the battle cry was that PIP wasn't important...until profile 1.1 came out. Then (according to the smurfs) no one cared about internet connectivity; but now that 2.0 is somewhere out there (and may land sometime in Oct.), it's a worthwhile feature.

Imitation is said to be the sincerest form of flattery. HD DVD must feel pretty good about itself then, since blu wants to be just like it when it grows up...

It's amusing, really. They go ahead and claim the interactivity of the extras are what makes it so special...

...and then you point out that all players currently on the market except the PS3 won't support them and all of the sudden it's a feature no-one needs or will want, I mean, after all, the movie still plays...

This means the end of players getting cheaper, we all lose by this announcement.

Sad.

You're right, what alliance or corporation wants people to buy their players. What alliance is going to forbid its members to lower the price of their players.

OPEC
Airlines
etc.

See my comment below. I wanted HD-DVD to win too, but basic economics will not suddenly disappear now that Sony has no HD-DVD competition.

Did DVD players stop getting cheaper? They are still getting cheaper... and so are Blu-ray. Silly billy. *rolls eyes*

Do they sell players?

*chuckle*

You're right, airlines sure dont want their blu-ray or hd-dvd players to go down in cost! Good comparison! They dont produce products that the consumer can buy. They sell tickets to use their jets, not something the average joe can take home with them.

"What alliance is going to forbid its members to lower the price..."

Learn to read and understand, you simply cant take the answer without reading what it was in answer to ...

I realize what that was in response to, I also realize that comparing corporations which provide services to ones which produce tangible and user consumable products is like comparing cars to winter sleds.

I think you need to read. Someone made a comment about organisation and players, he replied with organisation that don't make players. Regardless of what point he was trying to make, it was still wrong, considering the original comment.

What service does OPEC sell? I do believe that oil is a tangible and user consumable product.

Well they certainitely don't sell players!

Replace "players" with "products".

It's called a comparison, and it was used to show the absurdity of the comment it replied to.

Stay in school and you may yet learn these things.

Here are a few new words you might find interesting:
(From Dictionary.com)

COLLUSION

1. a secret agreement, esp. for fraudulent or treacherous purposes; conspiracy

2. Law. a secret understanding between two or more persons to gain something illegally, to defraud another of his or her rights, or to appear as adversaries though in agreement: collusion of husband and wife to obtain a divorce.

OLIGARCHY

1. a form of government in which all power is vested in a few persons or in a dominant class or clique; government by the few.
2. a state or organization so ruled.
3. the persons or class so ruling.

Hmmmm....now lets see here...where might we have seen these types of concepts come into play recently in the news......????

Sounds like the HD DVD crowd alright. Except they lost regardless.

It's called not answering the question. Looks like you are the one who needs to stay behind in detention. Or maybe going back to primary school where you can learn these concepts properly is in order for you.

What question?

look at the thread again.

See a question mark in any of the replies leading to this comment?

Huh...

Reading comprehension, much?

No, not quite.

These terms apply to what we have seen from the Blu-ray camp so far...and I don't expect that to change any time soon unfortunately.

Now that they have won the "war", I fully expect that we will see their collective behavior get even worse now instead of better, because there is no major competitor left to keep them honest or keep them in check.

The sad thing here is that now that they have won, they are going to be deluded into thinking that the types of things they did to mislead and defraud consumers so that they would buy their unfinished, non-upgradable players, are perfectly acceptable.

They aren't.

Check out this quote on Wikipedia's High definition optical disk war article: "On February 19, 2008, Toshiba officially announced that it would stop the development of the HD DVD players, effectively conceding the format war to the Blu-ray Disc format". Viva Blu-Ray!!

Well, all the Blu-ray fans and buyers out there can now forget about ANY stand alone Blu-ray players selling below $399 for the next five years or so.

They can't raise prices, because consumers won't stand for that under any circumstances, but they now have no reason to ever lower prices again for any reason.

Once yet again, big corporations and their greed for profit wins while consumer choice, lower prices and options lose.

Thanks Sony and friends in the Blu-ray camp. Great job. Bravo. Keep up the good work.

You've obviously forgotton basic economics, cos it's obviously going to fall, with the numerous manufacturers competing against each other. Just like DVD in fact.

They will eventually, because, as misguided as Ben is 99% of the time, he is correct that right now Blu-Ray is a niche market and if they ever expect sales to come anywhere close to the sales of DVD players they have to get the price point close to the price of DVD players.

Until then, those without alot of money will see the $60 DVD player next to a $400 BR player and say, "screw it, I just wanna watch movies." and buy the DVD player instead.

The only thing that will enable sony to screw us is if the movie studios suddenly stop releasing titles on DVD altogether BEFORE the price of Blu-ray drops. Let's hope that doesn't happen.

Viva Blu Ray!

Of course they will lower prices! There is something called "Supply and Demand" that helps regulate prices.

Look it up!

Amen Testman!

Viva Blu Ray!

Of course they will lower prices! There is something called "Supply and Demand" that helps regulate prices.

Look it up people!!!

Sharp Aquos BDHP20U 1080p Blu-Ray Disc Player - Amazon.com - 9:20 AM Tuesday - $308.

Now, go pick some more bottles from the ditch and in a few months you can get one.

I saw lots of $99 Blu-ray AND HD players during the post-Christmas sales... it will come...

All of you XBOX HD-DVD lovers are so pessimistic.

Supply and Demand will control the price, not competition.

What competition does DVD have? For those of you too young to remember, it took awhile for prices to drop for both hardware and software.

My first DVD player was $500.00. Now how much are progressive scan DVD players?

I fought in the format wars, and won!

Do you know how supply and demand works? High demand, high prices, low demand, low prices (in order to increase demand). So...right now blu-ray is expensive and it's not in high demand, you're saying it will increase in price as demand rises since there is no HDDVD competition?

No? Well...that's what supply and demand is...at least learn what it is you're saying before saying it...

Please consider this:

When Blu-ray players first came on the market they were initially priced at around $1,200 retail. Shortly after, HD DVD players started shipping and they hit the market at approximately $700 to $900, immediately undercutting the price of all of the various manufacturers that made up the Blu-ray camp or "syndicate", if you prefer, at the time.

Shortly there after you started to see Blu-ray prices start to fall. Why was that you ask? Because the Blu-ray camp was trying to increase demand? NO! Because they were being UNDERCUT by a comperable, more agile, more aggressive COMPETITOR. When the Blu-ray players first shipped at those high prices, absolutely no one (except for the insanely wealthy with more money than they knew what to do with) bought them. Almost from the get go, Toshiba was consistantly providing a lower cost alternative in HD DVD players. Sony knew that they absolutely HAD to lower prices as Toshiba did or they would be deader than a door nail on their prized new format in the market place right out of the gate. (No one at that time was dumb enough to spend $500 more for Blu-ray than HD DVD and every single manufacturer in the Blu-ray camp knew it.)

Every time Toshiba lowered their prices, Sony and company soon followed. Why? Because they were FORCED to do it in able to have any hope of staying competitive or RELEVENT in the market! Because of the competition they HAD to lower prices.

The moral of the story here is this: if you want lower prices (and you want them sooner rather than later) the ONLY way you are realisticly going to EVER get that is with one simple factor: COMPETITION!

Notice that the previous sentence doesn't mention anything about "collusion among those within a cooperative syndicate".

Now, over the past year and a half you have all watched as Blu-ray prices dropped from $1,200 to the now common $399, (a full one-third of their original price!) in a relatively short period of time. You can start writing your "Thank You" letters to the Toshiba corporation for that now, if you like.

Now that HD DVD is gone (i.e. now no major competitor to Blu-ray in the high def disc format) how fast do you think you are going to see Blu-ray payer prices fall from here on out?

Exactly.

So, to all of those future Blu-ray buyers out there that have been waiting for the prices on the stand alone players to drop to the magical $149 price point that you now see HD DVD players at, I would offer this age old bit of wisdom as you ponder the current state of affiars in this market now in light of all the recent news and developments:

Be careful what you wish for....

because you might just get it.

Blu-ray's prices were already exorbitant with competition from HD DVD.

It stands to reason that without competition, the free movie offers are a thing of the past, as well as the incentive to lower prices on Blu-ray players to an attractive and widely acceptable point.

However, we will most certainly still see "fire sales" and give-aways of feature-crippled players with select HDTV purchases.

As much as the BD fan boys loved to loathe HD DVD's existence, one thing it managed to accomplish was force the BDA to counter with lower prices across the board... if only by a slight amount. If it weren't for competition, we would probably still see entry-level BD players and PlayStation 3 consoles anchored in the $600-$700 range. I would think you would weep for HD DVD's demise in that regard. I know I do.

I'm getting tired of agreeing with most of your posts, Mike. :)

Thank you very much for the kind words.

Well, if I am to be honest with myself, I must admit, I'm also getting tired of writing them. :)

You seem to forget that there's already competition with the different player manufacturers. Lowering prices willy-nilly does no one any good (as HD DVD found out). But the prices will drop, as it's basic economics.

Lets come back at christmas and reread your statement then.

To be perfectly honest, I really hope that you are right.

As much as I have supported HD DVD since both formats emerged, I am glad to see one of the formats take the crown, even if it is a Sony-backed one.

I had always hoped that HD DVD would come out on top, but I was a realist as far as not investing too much money into either format, knowing full well that one would vanish from the market eventually.

I am anxiously awaiting lower prices on the really nice feature-complete BD players by the time next holiday season rolls around.

Sure. And you have obviously fortten the definition of colorful terms like COLLUSION, PRICE-FIXING and OLIGARCHY.

If you can't tell the difference between what was happening with the emergence of DVD as a format and the blatent manipulation (back room buy-offs, pay-to-play, paying for strategic timing of press release based on those buy-offs, etc.) of what has gone on with the Blu-ray camp, you haven't been paying close enough attention.

No comparison. None.

Exactly...it might not have been obvious in my post...but I was disagreeing with blu-ray price dropping. :)

Hey chia, I'll buy your PS3 for $250 LOL

? Sorry man no sale.

History will look back on this and compare it to Beta and VHS. The better format lost. You can forget about capacity, it was never an issue.

Now that sony have won, expect the deals to disappear. Expect the prices of players to continue at their current price, with more profile delays to come.

I will stick with HD media players and skip the whole disk ownage ideology altogether. What DVD's I have owned I have transferred to file anyway. And it was something I wanted to do for a while with the kids.

It was fun while it lasted, Its not that I wanted Toshiba to win, rather that sony didnt. Now they have, knowing the features and capabilities of both, I know the best has lost.
The market was not ready, and the consumers never got the chance to decide.

Another idiot making silly predictions.

Blu-ray is still a relatively niche product, to drive it to mainstream adoption, price HAVE to fall. BDA know this, and it's what will happen.

Profile 2.0 is finalised, and has been for over a year now, so I don't really know what your point is. There is already Profile 2.0 players in Japan and Europe.

Actually I expect the price of the players to continue to drop, now that the manufacturers of said devices can compete properly, just like DVD in fact.

Profile 2.0 is finalised, and has been for over a year now, so I don't really know what your point is.

If I could only find them at my local store, or heck, even online...

Obviously you're looking at the wrong sites and shops.

If profile 2.0 is finalized, where is it?

One player available, and one that can be upgraded, don't mean much when NOTHING can take advantage of it...

Player availability does not mean the spec doesnt exist.

And like Beta/VHS, the 'betterness' was marginal... another 20 lines of resolution - wow. TV looked like crap, and so did tape - now SUPER Beta - that was awesome. Made my 200 line TV look like IMAX!!! VHS won in the same way - more studios chose it.

You can't throw out words like 'mass market' and 'profile 2' in the same sentence and expect anyone to care. You put BD next to DVD on a nice 40 inch screen, and everyone can see the difference. BD vs HD-DVD? Not so much.

If there had been a stockpile of compelling software for EITHER player, features would maybe have played a factor. One HD-DVD with PIP isn't exactly compelling...

Really Japan and Europe?
Wow so that would mean that next year as they have openly stated they will offer these same players here. Which still means nothing for NA consumers who are looking at this product and know nothing of the profile problem (difference between the versions of the profiles) If your expecting the prices to fall you have been listening to the same people who said the prices of the POS3 will fall and they really haven't as the costs for manufacturing have not changed.

IF any one is making diluted predictions its yourself only colaborated by your aliases.

It does to the consumer.

Show me one retailer in the US selling a 2.0 player other than the PS3.

Just one.

No?

Then as far as the consumer is concerned, it doesn't exist.

The spec has been final for over a year now, just because players are not yet on the shelf, does not make it final.

Players are on the European and Japanese market.

Someone else who fails to comprehend that finished spec does not guarentee product on shelves.

Profile 2.0 and java VM implementation takes time.

I note you put US in there, as the last time you asked, I made you look like an idiot by showing you one...

Last time I asked?

Do you have me confused with someone else?

I know, it's gotta be hard to keep up with all that trolling ya do.

if 2.0 is finalized then why was denonjeff on avs just stating that denon has no plans of a 2.0 player because the spec isn't finalized? this was just 4 weeks ago...

And how long did it take for DVD prices to come down? Prices would come down faster if they were competing with HDDVD. If it takes Blu-Ray that long for the price to drop digital downloads will have their lunch. You can already rent movies in HD with AppleTV. How long do you think it will be before Apple can convince the studios to let consumers keep them instead of just renting.

Well there's no rush, is there? What happened is that prices came down for HD DVD to unsustainable levels way too quickly (i.e. they couldn't afford it to come down) and they exited the business partly as a result (the other reason is that while they were selling players, no one was buying the discs as much as they were buying Blu-ray discs).

What is more likely to happen is that downloads will sit side by side with Blu-ray. Certainitely it's far easier to simply buy a disc instead of waiting hours or even days for the HD video to download before you can play it, IF your ISP hasn't throttled your connection in the meantime (and let's not get into where you're allowed to play it, thanks to DRM).

scrape japanese from that list, just cant find one advertised - eiden however do list one coming out next month on the 17th.

But..but...but... how can this be. i thought I read a story yesterday that this was a DENIED RUMOR?

Maybe because they didn't make the announcement yet. The word is not official until the company making the statement actually makes it. Until that happens it is just a rumor. Guess you fail to see the difference.

It was a denied rumor, didn't you read the headline? At 3:00 AM Eastern time THIS MORNING it was confirmed. Not before.

But....but...but...how can this be? I thought you said your last post was going to be in some thread a week ago, but yet, you're still here.

nate this person deserves a +1

For better or for worse at least there will be one standard for HD in the physical medium. Hats off to Toshiba though, they didn't drag their feet too long and made the right choice.

Absolutely :)
One less thing for people to bicker about is a win as well

Yay Sony Fanboi's rejoice as the war is over. After work today I am still not purchasing any Bloray disks and have no interest in purchasing any of your recorders / players.

"Most of us won't see an affordable HD option until late next year at the soonest."

You wouldn't want a bloray player till then and just a little tidbit of info look into profile 2.0 before making any informed decisions.

You want to spell it properly. It's Blu-ray.

BTW some people (read the majority) don't really care for the extra features. Profile 2.0 only makes network features mandatory (compared to Profile 1.1) so it's not as if it's a big loss if you have a Profile 1.1 player.

no i will stick with Bloray as the format does nothing for the future of the movie industry. As for your claims that Profile adds only network features perhaps you should reread what the difference is as you have missed something in the translation from plain english to idiot.

Actually it is you that has missed it. Maybe you want to reread the profile specs again and see what the difference between Profile 1.1 and 2.0 is.

http://www.gizmorepublic...ng-you-wanted-know-1270

Also, learn to spell properly in proper English and not change letters just to be childish. Some of us left that rubbish back in primary school.

Not the best article to read to compair. It does miss some other changes that make that internet interaction much more powerful.

You're probably right but that's basically the gist of it.

Blu-ray has superior security and a superior patented plastic coating that made some other yuppie a-holes rich beyond their means.

Sony are devils but they were smart ones. They got their PS3 pre-built to play Blu-ray which got them the edge. That will continue to be marketed to high-end customers and slackers who live in their parents' basement and have no bills. Most of us won't see an affordable HD option until late next year at the soonest.

This reality sucks.

This is true. and now that Blu has won, I would suspect PS3 sales to SKYROCKET.

Adios 360.

"and now that Blu has won, I would suspect PS3 sales to SKYROCKET."

Why would they skyrocket because blu-ray won? Because people would rush out to buy a ps3 as a player? I doubt very much the ps3 sales would be affected by this news at this stage.
If anything the sales of blu-ray players that your average family was holding back from would increase.

Sorry to burst your bubble but Xbox 360 is going to be here for the run. Why does it upset you so much?

"Sorry to burst your bubble but Xbox 360 is going to be here for the run. Why does it upset you so much?"

Dave being Dave ?

So I wonder how cheap the players will get now. I want to get another one.

I felt it coming...I hate that the inferior, overpriced format won, but it was time for Toshiba to admit defeat at this point.

The only main difference between the VHS vs. Betamax is that this time it was the studios that spoke it into existence and not the consumers. Consumers as a whole clearly chose VHS over Betamax, but here the decision is not so clear. Yeah there'll probably be those who argue that consumers chose Blu-Ray, and perhaps given equal studio support who knows what would have happened? Still--I think HD-DVD had the best chance. Sony grabbed the studios out from under HD-DVD and that is what won the war for them.

".I hate that the inferior, overpriced format won,"

Deluded as usual. Dude, it's over, you can let the defenses down now, and admit Blu-ray has superior spec, not just the obvious space and bandwith advantages, but the Java and interactivity platforms, which whilst they took longer to develop, are now here.

If you want a wake up call. Remind us all how many HD DVD discs actually took advantage of PiP and interactivity....

I doubt you know, it's actually only 2% of releases...

And how many Blu titles...

Just because Blu-Ray won doesn't mean that it was superior. If all it took was to be superior Beta would of won too.

..

Just not worth it anymore. BJ is going to continue to try and delude folks, no matter how many times he gets schooled.

you talking about Ben getting schooled?

you are the one that looks beaten up. what's the matter, having a bad morning?

lmao..

Insanity was once defined as doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results.

Why on Earth would I continue trying to beat the same logic and common sense into Bj's head, arguing the same BS he posts over and over again, as we've been trying to do since the beginning when it is so obviously never going to get him to stop spewing it?

Go ahead and troll some more. It's fun to watch, I just won't be joining in the 'fun' this round.

I especially enjoyed the "Back at ya SGD" post of yours. That must have taken some real talent and brain power. Keep it coming, looks like it's going to be an entertaining day :)

rofl!

Well said, thats my entertainment fix for the night, time for bed.

I'm sure he'll come up with something in response though, I can picture it now..... "insanity to you too ho ho there you go!.. so there!" :)

*edit - ohhhh he removed the "Back at ya" comment. :) ROFL!

I guess it is a crime to state his opinion on the formats. Funny how if someone doesn't agree with what you think you attack them.

No it doesn't mean it was superior. But it was regardless.

And yet all the production studios of the day used Beta and Super-Beta... odd...

*edit - ohhhh he removed the "Back at ya" comment. :) ROFL!

Still there. Go into your preferences and set it to show comments with negative moderation.

...opens up a whole new world of trolls and flamers.

...many still do.

you won't be joining in the fun this round? what you changed your mind there guy?

arent you the one that gets his panties in a bunch every time that ben or me or anyone else makes a comment about blu/sony?

listen its simple. don't reply. thats it. not rocket science chief.

back at you Tool.

Just wanted to try and change the tone a little bit.

See me replying to ol' Bj?

No?

Get it through your thick head: My comment was regarding him...and his posts. (Did you miss the numerous references to him?)

I know you worship him and want to be *just like* him, but even he has more brains than you do, so give it up, jackass.

and yet you reply to me again.

do i really have that much control over you? you want to make me look like a fool. don't reply.

just let it go lad.

*laughs*

I would, but this is so much fun....

you want to make me look like a fool.

No need, you've proven yourself more than capable of accomplishing this without any outside help whatsoever.

just let it go lad.

Why? You haven't ceased to be entertaining yet. I am quite sure you have so much more to say to further corner your stranglehold on idiocy. I'm just waiting to see it.

really you have no friends. Just sad.

Actually, I like him.

I love the simplicity and the ease with which he trashes the comments of urchins like yourself.

I spend most of my visiting time here laughing at his comments to you and your ilk.

He can be my friend any day.

whatever you say tool2.

I'd rather be 'tool2' than 'homer2'.

I like the 'Homer' in your name. How very appropriate.

how sad it has come down to you posting under a different name.

i'm almost sorry i did this to you. just sad.

Few things:

I have one alt on this forum, and the pig it ain't.

You accuse me of having no friends. Why? Because I am the only one pointing out your stupidity here now, and the rest have moved on? (They're just pointing out your stupidity elsewhere)

As for you doing anything *to* me... That's rich. I don't do anything I do not want to do. I really want to hope that you get to experience what that is like when you grow up, but I fear you are probably heading more down the "flipping burgers" path.

Sad? I suppose. You're still here, after all. One must begin to wonder what kind of neglectful parents you must have...

Different name?

Eh?

I've always used this name.

Idiot.

Sorry Homer thought I was you, or you me.

*sigh*

Life as me isn't so bad. Honest.

:@)

Don't apologize for the mentally disabled. It's not PC, ya know....

Toshiba is the smart one! Within five years DVD's of any definition will be left in the dust . . . no more than a museum piece much as CD's have become.

no more than a museum piece much as CD's have become.

One has to wonder what planet you're on...

Toshiba is the smart one! Within five years DVD's of any definition will be left in the dust . . . no more than a museum piece much as CD's have become.

CD's still make lots of money today. Look at the electronics section of your local Wal-Mart.

True, CDs are not nearly the market they once were, but to say they are a museum peice is just plain bulls***.

"Toshiba is the smart one!"

With 100's of millions down the tube they're almost as wise as you Mr.Cat

He's not entirely off, although CDs are still widely used. Music is being pushed more and more toward online sales, however, and if we're talking about general disc burning of data then most people will opt for DVDs.

Wal-Marts aren't permitted in the city where I live so I wouldn't know. One of the museums here already has an exhibit displaying 8-tracks, cassettes, and CD's alongside a space reserved for DVD's. I sometimes forget that the hinterlands are a bit behind and that some out there are even squabbling over plastic discs!

Right here in the good ol' U.S.A.! Which outpost are you writing from?

Can you go and check if they have a space for HD DVD, please?

*cheeky!*

The lies that Toshiba told have come out.. Anyone under the illusion that there were over a million HD DVD players out there? Well you were lied to..

http://www.engadget.com/...ess-conference-in-tokyo/

Q: How many HD DVD players and recorders, exactly, did you sell?
A: 600,000 players in the US -- 300,000 of which were Xbox 360 HD DVD drives. 100,000 units were sold in Europe. And about 10,000 players and 20,000 recorders in Japan. So about 730,000 units worldwide.

A MERE 300,000 STANDALONE PLAYERS IN THE US. LOL.. NATE MOOK< HOCKUPOKUS AND HOLLYWOOD__ MUST BE CRYING IN THEIR BREAKFAST...

Ahh...I was wondering when the gleeful giggling of the schoolgirls would begin.

Nice to see we can depend on ya, BJ.

It's people like you Ben that make people like me not like Blu-Ray.

i don't know if would be flashing those numbers around too much all they do is show how truly pathetic blu-ray media sales really are. if there really is only 300,000 standalones in the us and blu could still only manage a 3:1 4:1 media lead is really really pathetic. now you got your prize so go home

And the lies continue.

That's 600k standalone in the US, not including 300k Xbox 360 drives.

"However, the company left open one very small door: the possibility that HD DVD may have a future in notebook PC drives."

They will announce that soon too. They are using that avenue to get rid of excess stock in the supply chain. Once all the current HD DVD components are used up, so will HD DVD notebook drives (no media companies will be producing for them anyway).

You know something? I was actually pulling for HD-DVD to win, because I thought the PS3 being the lowest denominator in the videogame war this generation would hamper BluRay as a result. Shows what I know, ya think?

Then again, at least the great HD disc debate is finally resolved. (And about damn time, I might add.) That alone should provide consumers an incentive to finally make a commitment owing that many were waiting for something like this to happen first.

Of course, Sony could have just as easily pulled a "Betamax" once again; but oddly enough, all positioning has for some "bizarro" reason gone and flipped over it's head this time around.

I leave you all with this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywWfmRdOmJ0

Its about time the superior format has won. I am glad the war is over and I cannot wait to obtain a new, hopefully soon lower priced, blu ray player!

You left us all with that video in the last thread.
Keep your spam to yourself

Keep dreaming for that "lower priced" part ... Sony + no competition != lower prices!

Well the players will get lower with time. But there is certainly no reason for the media to :)

@onemorechance, you are aware that there are numerous companies making Blu-ray players aren't you? This isn't HD DVD you know.

As long as you keep your useless comments to yourself also ;-)

You do realize that Sony is not the sole proprietor for Bluray dont you? You do realize its a consortium of companies and businesses backing BRD. Sony is only one of them.

Back at ya!

*yawn*

Sony owns the patents. That kind of makes them sole proprietor, since they determine how much they license for.

Amazon baby. the discs have been cheap for a loooong time.

backat ya SGD!

So creative.

And back at you too!

*bigger yawn*

You do realise that Sony don't hold all the patents? That 18 companies hold various patents on the Blu-ray standard?

http://www.mpegla.com/news/n_07-02-21_pr.pdf

But hey, why let facts get in the way?

They own the majority of the ones that make up the hardware and the format. This is all that really matters.

Argue it all you want, the fact remains Sony owns Blu-Ray, much in the same way a majority stockholder "owns" a company.

You can stick your head in the sand if you like and pretend the facts are not there, but the facts are there in black and white.

Please take a class in economics.

Viva Blu Ray!

Of course they will lower prices! There is something called "Supply and Demand" that helps regulate prices.

Look it up!

another CHECK and MATE for TESTMAN.

Better luck next time Tool.

What, you're his pet now?

Try using your brain once in a while. Majority stockholder=controlling interest. Majority patent-holder=controlling interest.

Get your head out of testman's a** and you might actually be able to see that basic little concept there.

But...I'm done arguing it with you. See it as it plainly is, or don't. Red pill or blue. Fantasy or reality. Your choice.

Nope not good enough, still CHECKMATE for testman.

Please try again.

yea thats my point.

Facts never are good enough for the terminally stupid.

Sorry, the help you need to understand such basic facts are beyond my ability to provide. Please see a mental health professional.

And a strike 2.

Please try again.

And they are still not the sole proprieter and don't hold the patents (which you claimed before). Therefore, your posts were wrong, no matter how you spin it in future posts.

It's OK. Everyone is wrong once in a while.

For God sake grow up.

And to think that we thought Dave was a pathetic piece. He has lost the crown homer is the winner.

you and me both buddy.

again. don't reply.

now bow down to me peasant!

Not gonna happen. Still amusing.

I am really interested in seeing the depths to which your stupidity and total denial of reality.

you and me both buddy

Yeah, what a come-back. Did you have to ask your Mom for help with that one?

forget that you are no longer worthy of a comment..

Don't call me buddy I am not your friend and I do not want to be.

Because there was a format war going on

Friend no, but he'd make a decent forum pet.

What a complete load of toss and bollocks this thread is. Stop arguing girls. [tsk]

Bah. It's a day old and buried already.

Seriously...who cares? (Aside from the little old ladies such as yourself, of course, ma'am.)