Any numbers yet?

What's Blue-Ray?

I can't wait until this war is over, not so much because I care who wins but because of all the hilarious quotes we'll have to look back on. For example:

"DIVX is a great feature for those who rent VHS. That's the market it's aimed at. If you're not that customer, GREAT. But I CANNOT comprehend why people are so hell bent on bashing it. Get over it. DIVX is here to stay."

Disney was DIVX exclusive by the way, just throwing that out there. :P

That was a good one. I vaguely remember that... about as much as I expect to remember half of the quotes from some of the Blu-ray extremists years from now. :)

Yeah, there are plenty we'll remember regardless of who wins.

"Transformers on DVD looked just as good as HD when upconverted on my PS3!"

I just bought my HD-A2 from my local Wal-Mart and all I can say is that I couldn't be happier with my purchase. I don't know why alot of people complain about loading times, but mine is very quick. Takes about 30 seconds to boot and a few seconds more to load the movie, so can we please drop this "long load times" crap...

Welcome to HD and enjoy your purchase. The people that blast the unit about load times are blu boy shills just ignore them. They are just mad about the sale and how well it did.

Now that we all have the HD-DVD player's how long until the HD-DVD disk prices come down?Isnt it a little odd to think the disks cost almost 1/3 the cost of a $99 player? $19 is reasonable because thats what you would have spent for two people to see the movie, so its worth paying that to have your own copy.

I think we'll see plenty of low priced HD-DVD movies for this holiday season.

I'm thinking with two movies at $29.99 each, thats almost a year of the $4.99 Netflix plan... Hmm

Buy on amazon and most prices are $20-23 per title.

I'm in agreement with this. But if HD DVD keeps this sales momentum, disc prices will fall quite soon.

~$20 was the magic price point for DVD way back when.

I wish that magic price point still applied for 2-disc 'Collector's Edition' DVDs and the like these days. Some new releases on DVD are still quite pricey, even with the digital transfers taking less time and effort as evidenced by the much faster transitions from box office to retail shelves now.

The Internet > Movies.

That simple.

I'll admit there are some compelling movies out there, but when push comes to shove, I spend my time online and less watching the tripe released every year. The fanboi wars are amusing to witness, however.

Oh hurah hurah all those "made in Taiwan/China" budget HD-DVD players are being sold cheaply, fantastic... good thing too, as it won't be a big deal to throw them out when they are no longer of any use (I guess thats what the stores are doing now ;) Got to hand it to them though they're really trying to get rid of those puppies.

Meanwhile across the pacific, visiting the local Bic Camera store (the bigest electronic retailer in Japan - Shinjuku store) over the weekend I was surprised to find a very large section of the AV department dedicated to Blu Ray (blu Ray Corner)... New Video recorders from Sony and Panasonic with BD capability were released this month. You would think there was only one HD format available... Very crowded!! If this new trend continues it will be another nail in the coffin for HD-DVD... for the Japanese market anyway... not that its a big market or anything...

"Oh hurah hurah all those "made in Taiwan/China" budget HD-DVD players are being sold cheaply, fantastic..."

And where do you suppose "main stream" BD players are manufactured? Or the majority of consumer electronic products sold in the USA for that matter? You Sony/BD shills need to give it a rest already. I know it hurts to see an HD-DVD player for such a low price, but trying to pretend HD-DVD is losing, won't make it true.

This is just like when you Sony cheerleaders try to pretend like the PS3 is catching up to the Wii and Xbox360, even though it's being outsold world wide, month after month. Notice I said WORLD WIDE, because you kids love to pick a specific time frame in a specific market where the PS3 miraculously outsells the other consoles for a week or two, but make no mistake, over all the PS3 is selling like crap.

Anyway, HD-DVD is here to stay, so you better get used to it.

"Meanwhile across the pacific, visiting the local Bic Camera store (the bigest electronic retailer in Japan - Shinjuku store) over the weekend I was surprised to find a very large section of the AV department dedicated to Blu Ray (blu Ray Corner)..."

What does this have to do with anything? Japan is known as the "tech" capital of the world. It's normal over there for an over priced, proprietary technology to become fairly popular. Take the MiniDisc for example. It never gained much popularity in the US or world wide, but it was rather popular in Japan. Just because they accept a certain technology over there, doesn't mean the technology automatically wins world wide. Far from it.

Hmm theres no 'large' section dedicated to blu-ray in that store unless its on a seperate level I have not seen?
Has a blu-ray section though just like any other eiden or bic store, nothing overwhelming.
What makes you think blu-ray players are not made in China? It was only last week in Japan that a media outlet kicked up a fuss about Japanese purchasing Chinese goods over local.

I guess someone here forgot that someone else lived in Japan too, eh? :)

Shinjuku Odakyu buildings BIC, 3rd Floor... get off the escalator and look left. Next time I'll take a photo ;) Its all Blu Ray... you have to look hard to find HD-DVD. As for the made in China comment, true I am sure BD is also made there... just pointing out that the quality of a $200 player can't be all that great, you get what you pay for...

Actually MiniDisc did not do so well here either. But I do believe that if BD begins to take a foothold in Japan it could have an influence abroad. True accepting it here is not an automatic win world wide... but the market is quite global.... Japan also chose VHS over Betamax.

Don't really care if a HD-DVD player was free... I wouldn't take one... these price drops are entertaining though...

As for being a Sony cheerleader... I own both a WII and Xbox 360 they are awesome machines... dont own a PS3... it will be worth buying when a) the price goes down (11th Nov 2007), and b) Gran Turismo 5 is released (some time in 2008) so I'm waiting till some time in 2008... yeah some cheerleader.

Ok I will have a look when I arrive back there again. The section must have grown a considerable amount over the past month and a half because it was still small (unless by large you mean the signs hanging around saying blu-ray).
I have not even seen HD-dvd in that store to be honest, as with most other stores. Blu-rays one of those things that will always do well in Japan even if it completely collapses else ware in the world. It's already the standard.
For those that say blu-ray is huge in Japan, that’s completely ignorant. It’s not by any means and has a 9:1 sales lead over hd-dvd there - HD-dvd there sells right next to 0 (stuff all). SD-DVD sales in Japan this year alone is already at a all time high. One should not underestimate the popularity of the upscalling players compared to blu-ray/hddvd players.

Hehe im not a perm legal resident in Japan until next year :)
Counting down though

Eh? MiniDisc DID do well here. Its dying off now, but previously you had machines everywhere where you could put music onto your discs. It was the cool thing to have a portable MD player, not to mention almost every hi-fi unit you purchase has a md player built into it.

I passed on a chance to visit Japan when I was in the Air Force years ago. I would still like to visit at some point in my life, but I don't foresee that happening now.

Ah you should go there sometime to have a look around. I stay away from Tokyo, hate the place far too many foreigners there and our name is currently Mud there after recent activities.
Fantastic tourist place for tech though if that’s your game :)
If you are in that region check out Korea too!! The people there are far more enjoyable than Japanese.

Just FYI, the HD-A2 I purchase on Friday said "Made in Japan" on the side, not made in China.

I would rather spend 100 dollars on a player from China then a 400 dollar player from China. Comes from the same assembly lines. Funny how people spend $30 for a DVD and 5 years later it is still working. Guess that kind of shots your theory all to hell.

Then you are not a true movie fan.

To be fair, Made in "x" means very little. It may have been assembled in Japan with parts imported from Pluto for all we know.

Cool, good luck with that! I've got another 2 years to go to hit the magic 10 year mark... Still have to get our mugshot and prints taken as of Nov 20th though.... We get a raw deal here thats for sure.

and hd-dvd users get online rentals from blockbuster? i've seen several posts stating they are blu exclusive went to there website and it didn't say anything either way emailed them and they told me they do carry hd-dvd for online rental? moving in a few weeks want to sign up for netflix or blockbuster i kinda want to do blockbuster because they have a store about 2 minutes from where my new house is, thanks for any info (dave/joey/steve no need to reply because i won't beleive you anyways)

I have not.

As far as I have been told, they are only Blu-ray-exclusive in the brick-and-mortar locations, and even that is up to the discretion of the individual location.

here's the email i got doesn't seem very exclusive to bluray to me

Response (Glen) 11/03/2007 10:53 PM
Hello Craig,

Thanks for contacting BLOCKBUSTER Online Customer Care.

I appreciate you for taking time in writing us. Please know that Blockbuster Online carries the following DVD formats : Letterbox, PS/Pan and Scan (AP), Widescreen, Anamorphic Widescreen, Superbit, HD and Blu-Ray. You may log in to our website www.blockbuster.com . The "Browse Movies" menu is located at the top of each page. Use the cascading menus to browse within categories and sub-categories and find the titles you're looking for. Specifically, you can find Blu-Ray and HD DVDs under the Collections category.

I hope this information helps. Please let me know if there is anything else I can do for you.

Always here to help,

Glen
Customer Care Associate
BLOCKBUSTER Online

FYI:

Best Buy, Circuit City and Wal Mart are sold out of not only A2's but A3's as well. The $98 dollar sale convinced enough people to buy up all the remaining players, even at $199 after the Friday sale. There are plenty of $499 Blu Ray players if anyone wants them.

I also read that more 360 add-ons have been sold than all of the stand alone (not including the PS3) BD players combined.

"Based on recent NPD data, there have been more Xbox 360 HD-DVD players sold than all Blu-ray standalone players combined. The Playstation 3 simply hasn't been the gamer changer Sony had hoped it would be."

Not that I'm rooting for HD-DVD or anything, I thought you guys should know ....... especially Joey

Great news. I'm glad to hear that the profile challanged blu-ray players are still sitting on the shelves.

Awesome, I wonder how many were sold in total. Didn't Walmart alone have 2M?

i really hope somebody (betanews) can find some real numbers one how many hd-dvd units were sold during the sales

We are really working on trying to get numbers.. I have pings out to everyone I know that may have something. We'll have a little bit of follow up on Monday...

i kinda figured you would this is gotta be some huge news in the hd world

Have a feeling the numbers are going to be impressive.
If HD-DVD is only 1:2 to blu-ray they just need to double their standalone player sales. At those prices I would have expected quite a strong increase in sales and stronger movie sales increases over the next few months.

"profile challenged" - that's classic

Why not make some up. Most of your "news" is based on rumour, conjecture and sometimes pure fanboy imagination...

You're thinking of blu-ray.com.

What was their latest fanboy post? That's right it was called "Warner Brother considers Blu Ray exclusivity"

Only to be proven wrong by one of your own members. Watching you guys jerk each other off at the mere possibility was funny enough.

I'll throw a number out there:

3.5 million HD-DVD players were sold over the weekend and another 2 million are coming to fill back orders.

Woo Hoo, thats more than PS3 units SOLD!

Your such a hypocrite that I don't even know where to start.

So says Joey "Nope, 8 Per Store" Deacon.

You're a laughing stock. Please, feel free to keep posting... hypocrite.

Upset that HD had a good weekend I see. Go cry somewhere else. If you don't like stuff on the site no one is making you come back. I say good bye to you.

Some of the trolls over at bluray said that they bought one (A2) to see what all the fuss was about and the guy gets attacked. They have gone as far as claim that AVS forums took the digital bits site down. Only to find out they are doing service to the system.

I think the average age there must be 12.

Heh, reminiscent of the prison scenes from American History X. How quickly they turn on their own. :)

Lol jesus its like predicting the future ten years in advanced accurately here compared to some of those 'blu-ray sites' I’ve seen

‘Most of your "news" is based on rumour, conjecture and sometimes pure fanboy imagination’
If you truly thought this you would not come here. Deep inside a part of you knows the news here is accurate. It just hurts you that there isn’t a blu twist on everything.

From their initial shipment yes
So if they didn’t sell very many earlier on, they just sold a s*** load.

Dave you are such an idiot.

A bunch of rabid pit bulls.

That site is a joke. They fail to understand that the web knows what they are up to and are makign fools of themselves.

And HD DVD is thanking you for singlehandedly pushing half our readership to their format.

Maybe your a plant for Toshiba acting anti- HD DVD to spur sales? Hmmm...

Now that was a comment I was not expecting from you. :)

Kudos.

i agree 100% and thanks again joey/steve/dave for helping me decide to save $300 and get a hd-dvd player

Just a note of help from BetaNews:

I've been advised by several sources that those who have purchased multiple players are only eligible for ONE 5 free HD DVD offer per mailing address. That is how Toshiba will/has be(en) handling this.

So if you sent them out, only one of your rebates will be honored. Some have reported success by using a different mailing/e-mail for second and third tries with the offer. So if you have 3 players, you can get all 15 movies as long as you have three different addresses.

Seems to be the same for Blu-ray's offer as well, I'll get confirmation on that.

Just your friendly HD disc tip of the day from BetaNews :)

Thanks Ed.

Unfortunately I did not get to take advantage of the deal this weekend, but I'm sure many will find that very useful.

Hey Joey,

With all the time you wasted convincing people HD-DVD is better than BD with your completely BS fanboy posts (although your "mission" was to come here and do the opposite), when do you actually play that god awful PS3?

I've used mine to watch Blades of Glory, Casino Royale, and I rented one game so far. Other than that it basicically collects dust (like the one in the picture you posted).

Ding Dong Blo-Ray's Dead.

Off the Blu-ray forums:

"When deciding on a format:God has a Blu-ray player because it represents water and life and the Devil has a HD DVD player because it represents fire and death. You decide?"

Nutters.

Amazing.

Spoken by the idiots of the web.

Trying to make sense of "All Your Base Are Belong To Us" is easier than that person's ridiculous statement.

That's just plain stupid... a hundred and some-odd pounds of stupid.

that is really sad and scary at the

I forwarded that to Warners corporate email

That's typical of the attitude over there. They feed on each others nonsense and somehow think they are part of something truly great.

None of them are true movie fans, they have a completely different perspective of this silly format war.

I just want to be able to watch any movie on any format, which I can do. I just prefer any dual release on HD-DVD over BD.

HD-DVD has released most of the movies I own, but there will be a few Blu's come November / December added to my collection.

Joey and his kind has completely turned me off to Blu Ray (and a lot of other people here as well). I simply stopped buying BD movies because I dont want to help thier retarded cause.

"I just prefer any dual release on HD-DVD over BD."

I agree with you completely...to the point that I import BR movies that have been released in Europe/Japan on HD DVD.

who the hell cares about choosing sides on a product line?? BD vs HDDVD...xbox vs PS3...who cares??? buy the product that best suites your needs or budget and enjoy, no one outside specific fanboi forums gives 2 craps about 1 format over another as long as consumers win in the end. and with the current battles going on, they are.

ZOMG BLUERAY HAS BETTER QUALITY, BUT XBOX HAS MORE GAMES!!11?@

(imho)

Just to let you know if you get it at best buy you get 9 free dvds because 2 come inside the box!

wow bestbuy is actually taking care of it's customers by handing out the A3 to ppl who bought the A2 but ran out of stock, for no extra cost, 99 bucks is pretty damn sweet

now i'll wait for joey to tell me it's just desperation

I hope a great deal comes out for the A35 I ould like the output of undecoded audio for my reciever to do instead.

I'm really looking forward to the HD-XA2 price to come down more, as I would love to have multi-channel analog outputs as well as 1080p/24 capability.

For the time being, I'm about to order an Oppo DV-980H as my next universal DVD player.

Found this funny from bloray. Won't post the link since they do everything they can to block that kind of stuff so here ya go. Funny stuff here.

"Wow, the passion of some of the posters here is fervent. Great, but please, as we enter the final phase of this war, the last decisive battles, we as participants of this Forum need to remeber the following:

There are two words often used here on this Forum, 'Thanks' and 'Sorry'. We are a zealous and passionate group of men and women with a common interest, and as we enter these final two months of the 4th quarter, seeing desperate actions, deep discounting, last minute manuevering, tempers will flare. We're watching the final battles in this format war. The loss leader $98.00 dollar - one day only sale, is not a final blow, just an act of desperation, in the final hours of the battle.

In this costly battle, remember, we are in the stands, not on the field, observers, not players. Yes, we need to remain focused, help where we can, be respectful of all those who have a passion for high quality entertainment. This is more like a civil war, which when over, we are still kindred brothers, who for a period of time chose a side, fought their best, made a difference (for all us, a better quality product at a fair market price), and when the dust finally clears, we'll finally see and understand, that the purist Gold goes through the hottest furnice, and that the most beautiful polished stone went through to roughest tumbler. Out of adversity, comes advance . . . so, stay the course, remain focused, be motivated for your cause, and if wounded or embarrased along the way, towards victory, remember - you helped shape the outcome of the war - benefitting all, not just a few" [Jim

I guess Joey / Dave didnt get that memo. What a bunch of retards.

Most people have something better do do that worry about a format war, these guys obviously don't. I think it has consumed thier life and has become the most important thing they can focus thier time and energy on.

Showing everybody what a bunch of misfit, angry nobody's these people are is exactly what other people need to see.

Here is the difference between HD-DVD supporters and BD fanboys. Someone over at AVS posted (in the HD-DVD players section) "if Blu Ray had at player at $98 dollars tomorrow, would you buy one?"

Almost every single person said yes ..... but only if it was 1.1. You couldn't find a single BD zombie who said they wanted an HD-DVD at $98 dollars, one with completed specs I might add.

Wow, very... Winston Churchill. *sigh*

dave/joey/steve and the entire bloray forum are the best spokesman HD-DVD could ever have

"one with completed specs I might add."

COUGH triple layer COUGH..

COUGH how many HD movies are over 7 hours long COUGH..

"just an act of desperation"

Hillarious!

That's what Sony said of VHS.

Wait, which way did that battle go again? :-D

Wait, wasn't Betamax the better format too?

Oh right, it was and it still lost out.

These bluray forums are a riot to read. It's silly, as if all bluray supporters were 12 years old (they probably are, with the PS3s daddy bought them).

HAHA!

Does it require buying a new player? NO!!! It is nothing more than an improvement on a feature HD DVD already has - Combo's.

And my player appears to be ready for it. It has an option for choosing which version to play (HD DVD or DVD) when playing Twins.

Nobody here ever touts TL discs as the next big thing for HD-DVD, Why? Because until it's happens it's simply a rumor.

Unlike you idiots who seem to think the magical firmware for the PS3 is going to make it a 1.1 player and /or 2.0 spec. Sony hasn't even said the PS3 will be 1.1 or 2.0 publicly. But that's OK because it's for your wannabe BD player called the PS3. Not to mention none of you PS3 zombies care that all stand alone player owners will be screwed.

That's OK too because they don't have a PS3, you guys are absolutely F'ed in the head.

"Joey" knows the only superior feature of BD is capacity, so he's pretending like all first gen HD-DVD players won't play triple layer discs.

He won't admit that BD is unfinished although they are all salivating over the 1.1 update for the PS3, which by definition is unfinished.

Nice try Joey / Dave.

"just an act of desperation" Hillarious!
"That's what Sony said of VHS."

Link???

Joey's asking for a link. Isn't irony wonderful...

lol yes it is

Sorry, pre-internet. You'd have to have been alive to have witnessed it.

You are welcome to head to your local library and browse news archives. Maybe you'll get lucky.

Thanks.

Why would they be excited about the 1.1 updaye since they say they could care less about the extras. That is they could care less once they found they were screwed and couldn't watch them after the update. They are the king or queens of double standards.

He doesn't need a link, BetaMax is gone.

Perhaps he should have said "That's what Sony fanboys said of VHS."

It's old news, but I believe the same strategies used by Sony then apply now. History indeed repeats itself. It was their arrogance that was their downfall then, and it will be again. Sony simply refused to acknowledge what consumers wanted. This format war is all too familiar, and I'm afraid it is sadly still in its infancy if the previous format war (which lasted a decade) was any indication.

I believe Blu-ray is eventually going to be another Sony format occupying a small niche market, and perhaps used in some select professional broadcasting applications, the same as Betamax.

Betamax failed at the consumer level where the majority of the money is made, and for years debates raged on why VHS defeated it (with plenty of rumors and speculation, and no single answer ever being agreed upon), despite VHS being technologically inferior. I expect in a few years time to see similar debates raging about HD DVD's triumph over Blu-ray, and I'm sure low cost will be a major determining factor as it was with VHS. However, Betamax still remained rather successful in certain other regions and niche markets, until DVD sales surpassed both formats in 2002.

Aside from being the obvious preferred storage medium for PlayStation 3 games, perhaps Blu-ray will still find its place somewhere in the market as Betamax did in the event HD DVD prevails in the current format war.

"Nobody here ever touts TL discs as the next big thing for HD-DVD, Why?"

Because as of right now they're not necessary? :)

Of course it's not finished, as Profile 1.1 is also known as Blu-ray 'Final Profile'... and it's not available yet.

I love that... calling it 'Final' when there's Profile 2.0 (BD Live) in the works... probably.

Blu-ray is nowhere near the level of maturity and completeness of HD DVD. I don't know why it's so hard for them to understand. Actually, I'm sure they do understand, they're just hoping nobody else does.

I'm sure somewhere this weekend there were 'Blu-Bloods' picketing outside a Wal-Mart chanting "The power of Blu compels you!"

MP3 and other compressed "inferior" music formats have won out over CD, DVD Audio and SACD so why should it be a surpise that HD DVD will win out over Blue Ray?

This time around, it will not be a surprise, as HD DVD is not the 'inferior' product.

Price will win this 'war', and Sony doesn't even act like it wants to make Blu-ray competitive.

Get lucky at a library?

*laughs*

I hear the philosophy section is a pretty good spot. ;p

Last thing I heard on the subject of capacity is that the 3 layer double-sided HD-DVD is 90GB so it looks like sony have lost on that front as well.

If you forget the movie aspect of HD vs. BD and think about the consumer market of home recording and backup you could be reminded of another media war (although a lot smaller I grant you) which was rewritable session discs (DVD-+RW vs DVD-RAM).

Panasonic was a key backer of DVD-RAM and that never really took off and they are now a backer of BD which I hate to say looks as if it is going to go the same way.

Wow.

Someone needs a reality check.

They have already fired all the guns they can afford to fire with the PS3. They had it all figured out. They would force it on people with the PS3 and help Blu-Ray win the format war. While it did help, all that they have really accomplished is that they prolonged Blu-Rays death and they brought the PS3 down with it.

If there was any site qualified to post news items regarding Blu-ray, BetaNews would definitely be at the top of the list.

The hardware and format are in a constant state of 'beta' with no guaranteed signs of going 'gold'.

They should just rename it to 'Beta-ray'.

Just so everyone knows, the new "battle plan" over at blu-ray.com is to have their members join all the A/V forums and try to convince people who bought A2's and A'3 yesterday to return them.

A few people wanted to stand outside Wal-Mart and talk people into returning them as they came out of the store ..... (Ugh).

I think we have a new shill direct from blu-ray.com or Dave had added another username to his repertoire.

Pathetic and sad.

And they are getting all pissed that people are going to their church to talk up HD there. Wha a bunch of queens of double standards.

I really hate that. I think trying to sway someone either way, simply because you prefer that format is just plain wrong. Give them the facts, let them decide.

There's a guy that talked 8-10 people into not getting the A2 for $99 at Walmart and buying a PS3 instead. Its fine if they did this based on movie selection, but I think the guy pretty much told them the A2 was inferior due to 1080i, 20GB less than blu-ray..etc.

Only tangible difference for the vast majority is price and movie selection.

Those pizza faces are all talk, I don't think they've even seen real day light for a over a year. But it is funny reading their ridiculous comments.

Incase you all missed this:

There is a 5 free movie rebate for any Toshiba HD-DVD player purchase. Hope it applies to the A2 (I'm gonna try it).

http://www.tacp.com/hddv...a_Online_Rebate_R08.pdf

The rebate applies to all toshiba players.

Oh, and just to throw this one out there because the story was pushed back so nobody is going to read it anymore...

http://bluray.highdefdig...Kmart:_Were_Purple/1137

"In a statement released late Thursday, Kmart VP Jonathan Magasanik said the following:

There have been numerous statements in the media today, attributed to Toshiba, indicating exclusive support for the HD DVD format in Kmart stores. These statements are false. Kmart intends to support both the HD DVD and Blu-ray platforms, and has no plans to support either platform exclusively."

So...What has the HD-DVD camp flat out lied about recently...

1. "We have 51GB Triple Layer discs!" WRONG...you have not produced a single one!

2. "Transformers HD-DVD sold 198,000 copies in its first week ALL TIME RECORD!" WRONG, you didn't sell anywhere NEAR that...and some sources say you didn't even sell as many as the Blu-ray version of "300"

3. "KMART is HD-DVD exclusive!" WRONG! AGAIN!

and they are dumping all these crippled non 1080p players on people who don't even have HDTV's telling them to get into the High Def game...one could say these tactics are rather anti consumer...because im sure Toshiba and its dying format are not going out of their way to inform consumers that they will see no benefit from these players without an HDTV...

What took so long for you to find out about something said on Thursday? hehe
(1) There is a triple layered disc, i guess you didn’t read about that? There is also larger blu-ray discs. Just because there isn’t a single one put out with a movie on it doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. Quite clearly everyone knows they do. You would have to be the first person to deny its existence.

(2) You are going by 'Anonymous representatives of two movie studios backing Blu-ray' to believe that. So that’s debatable to say in the least. Not to mention the 300 comparisons btw are comparing sales with BOTH formats in 300 not blu-ray exclusively or vise versa

(3) Yep got them there, seems a big c***-up by Toshiba again. However you can stop using the word dumping, it’s so far from the truth it’s not funny, its desperate. Anti-consumer? its exactly the opposite.. what on earth makes you think that way? (and thats from the view of someone who doesnt own either formats yet)

More desperation. Joey / Dave / Steve / Metfanant hasnt slept since the HD-DVD's went on the crazy sale.

Poor retard.

"However, even at these lower prices, many are still concerned with ending up with "Betamax" hi-def DVD player. We'll see what the holiday sales bring."

http://www.propeller.com...ice.html&frame=true

Go figure.

1. "We have 51GB Triple Layer discs!"

Yep, the technology is there. So what if it's not in use yet, do you have a need for a 7 hour HD disk? Do tell how.

2. "you didn't sell anywhere NEAR that..."
What are your sources?

Even if it's "significantly off", it's still impressive.

http://www.highdefdigest..._DVD_Sales_Numbers/1117

3. Sure they "aren't choosing sides" but they just did.

Thanks for the comment JD

I guess Sony is also dumping the PS3 to market since they are selling for under cost. What is the differenece you ask simple. You are just pissed that the Toshiba product is flying off the shelves and the PS3 sales have tanked plain and simple. You are a twit.

Exactly how do you know that people without HDTV's bought Toshiba A2's and A3's this weekend? That sound like desperate talk from a BD fanboy.

I guess Blockbuster going BD exclusive really didnt matter.

http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9809950-7.html

I could swear people said Blockbuster would guarantee a BD victory. Hey Matfanant?

Only blockbuster corporate went BD only. My local Blockbuster franchise owner told me that the franchises are free to carry whatever they want, and that he had no intention eliminating HD-DVD from his inventory. The selection was about the same, roughly one full shelf of BD and one full shelf of HD.

That's good to know but I haven't set foot in a Blockbuster in over 10 years.

Our local family owned store, one of the last around, has great prices and cute girls working there.

I hardy go there anymore either, it's all Netflix now, as I dont have to get up off my fat a** and go to a video store.

Even if it's "significantly off", it's still impressive.

http://www.highdefdigest..._DVD_Sales_Numbers/1117
no.. no it isn't but good try. the sales they claimed to try and be impressive is more than twice what was sold...

Sorry, I'm just not going to believe a blog post over a press release. Find real proof that the numbers are wrong and you may sway my opinion.

http://home.businesswire...;viewID=news_view_popup

Actually I am happy that Toshiba have gone for one last chance, blow-out sale before throwing in the towel...

damn man, the only desperation here is yours.

Give it a rest already.

1. I think you may be right here, but I don't think its all that bad - they are working on them.

2. Neilson doesn't report on Walmart and a few others. So you can't go purely by their numbers. This is still questionable, but can't be considered an outright lie.

3. KMart is not carrying (nor plans on carrying) any standalone blu-ray players.

And how is 1080i crippled? Its BS like this that is so aggravating.

If you have a 1080i or 720P set, why do you need a 1080P player??? Toshiba was smart - the vast majority of existing HDTV owners have 720P/1080i sets.

You do know Sony makes 1080i sets, right? I guess those are crippled too??

No, let him post, there are a lot of new HD-DVD owner in here because of him.

Thanks Joey. You made me proud, between your lying and desperation and my incredibly informative fact posting, a lot of new people know the joy of HD-DVD.

*gives Joey a round of applause*

You have a point. I retract my earlier request.

Thanks again for playing.

I think only you blu shills are concerned about only buying your movies at stores that get counted in surveys. I on the other hand buy at the store that is cheaper. You people are idots with your buy-a-thons and now waiting at stores and being a holes to people buying HD. You really are a bunch of clueless trolls.

Hmm Believe speculation or believe press statments
Thats a hard one :)

"Toshiba was smart - the vast majority of existing HDTV owners have 720P/1080i sets."

Exactly, just like the reason Microsoft decided not to include HDMI in the Xbox 360 at first, since the majority of customers could not use it anyway (and still cannot).

i have attached a link to a standalone of the HD-DVD, can anyone provide a link of a standalone Blo-ray @ Kmart

http://www.kmart.com/shc...nics&keyword=hd-dvd

i use blockbust online and i have above 30 HD-DVD in my que right now and one in my HD-DVD player right now.

Yours are the posts of desperation, going to get a big pay-cut since Sony is failing again?

1080p players will be absolutely useless in less than a year. Try finding an HDTV set at any of the big stores that doesn't do 1080i>1080p itself.

The new players simply don't need it. But really, is Sony charging $300 for *that*??

*laughs*

To be fair, not all displays de-interlaced 1080i properly in the past. I'm not sure about the majority available now though.

I recently bought Toshiba's HD-XA2 player and upgraded the firmware to version 2.5. I have it connected to my Gateway FPD2485W 24-inch 1080P HD monitor. When the XA2 is handling the video processing it does an excellent job with HD video thanks to its Silicon Optix Reon video processor, but it is by far the WORST player at standard definition DVD's. It has very poor noise reduction and it completely fails the "jaggies" tests on the Silicon Optix benchmark DVD.

My Oppo Digital DV-980H DVD player does a much better job at standard definition video processing with its cheap Mediatek video processor.

It was interesting today at the Best Buy that I work at. Many customers came in and compared the Blu-Ray payers to the HD-DVD players. They all liked and admired the performance of the Blu-Ray drives, no question about it, but not a single one of them was willing to pay $499 for one. Every one of them said "Now, why exactly should I buy a Blu-Ray player when there are HD DVD drives for $99 and $199?"

If you note in the article above where it mentions that Sony is unlikely to lower its Blu-Ray players below $400 this holiday season, it is pretty plain to see who is going to be the big winner in terms of sales volume for the remainder of this year.

Unless Sony does something very drastic to respond to the recent price drops on the HD-DVD side, and it doesn't look like they will, things look very bleak for the Blu-Ray camp right now...at least from a retail sales perspective.

You have to hand it to the HD DVD camp. They are playing it very smart right now in terms of marketing/pricing strategy. It looks like they are making the right moves in the market at exactly the right time to generate the maximum amount of excitement and interest with the consuming public.

You must be in a really poor neighborhood if nobody is willing to pay $499 for a Blu-Ray player. Seriously if you can't come up with a good reason to upsell a customer from a HD-DVD player to one of the Blu-Ray players your store must have really poor salemen.

Those $98 HD-DVD players that you saw at Wal-Mart were not that great of a deal really. I have a friend who had that same player that, I kid you not, took over 7 minutes to load one particular disc. At the very least a good salesmen would try to upsell a customer to one of the 3rd generation HD-DVD players.

Seriously if you think that Blu-Ray is doing poorly you really don't a clue. Blu-Ray discs are outselling HD-DVD discs. Look no further than an article on this site noting that sales figures from January to September showed that Blu-ray was outselling HD-DVD by an almost 2 to 1 margin. Given that there are more studios that are Blu-Ray exclusive than HD-DVD exclusive it will be difficult for HD-DVD to overcome that. Blu-Ray also has higher capacity which allows longer films, additional special features, and a richer soundtrack to fit on one disc.

HD-DVD is dropping prices out of desperation. If they can't keep up with Blu-Ray in sales this Christmas there won't be much of a future to the format.

"Because Toshiba are dumping the price of HD DVD below it's market value, in the hope to gain industry support".

"Blu-ray has the only long term viable business plan", "Buy Blu, buy the future, buy HD DVD, buy landfill".

That should cover it.

some cheese for your whine, crazy 8

Haha... 'Crazy 8'. Good one. :)

Movies that nobody wants, hmm?

http://blog.compete.com/...28/netflix-bluray-hddvd

* Those who set an HD format as their preferred format selected HD-DVD over Blu-ray by a factor of 2.4 to 1.

* Those who looked at the HD-DVD genre were 4.4 times more likely than Blu-ray browsers to actually set this as their preferred format.

I wonder why that is...

Upsell .... for only five times the cost ...... LMAO!

We have a new Dave username ... everyone write it down or perhaps he called in some help from blu-ray.com

Nope, it's Dave, I'm sure of it. The made up story about the 7 minute load tipped him off. It's over jackass, they're all gone, I know the blu-ray.com plan is to now get people to return them.

You bunch of insignificant nothings.

Please see post above it also applies to you. And you too are a twit.

Have you seen the load times on Pirates on blo-ray, guess not. Oh and seven minutes you are flat out lying.

Go back to bluray.com.

How about those obsolete stand alone players thanks to profile 1.1 if it ever comes out. You buy sony products before they are even complete equals moron.

The fact that HD DVD stand-alone players have been consistently outselling Blu-ray players even before the recent HD DVD price drops means that nobody is willing to pay $499+ for a Blu-ray player in any neighborhood.

yea, it seemed fitting heh

ugh where are these idiots coming from?
Who the hell denied blu-ray was outselling hd-dvd?
You must be new here. Welcome to betanews and for the love of god leave your s*** talking whereever it is you came from. 7 minutes is a flat out lie and you know it.
Sure if you want to believe its desperation you can, I'm sure you dont know jack s*** about business in the end in comparison.

Joey Deacon and his buddies can spew their diarrhea of the mouth all they want. Nothing is going to change the fact that there is a $99 and $199 HD-DVD player on the market right now. That is a FRACTION of the price of the cheapest BD player! Looks like Toshiba nailed that BD coffin shut. Now we just need to bury it, most likely around Christmas.

Joe Schmoe will probably return his $99 HD-DVD player when he find that discs take forever to load and that many of his favorite titles are from studios that are Blu-Ray exclusive. What good is a $99 player if you can't play the movies you want?

The content providers are ultimately going to determine the winner and the general consensus from the movie studios is that Blu-Ray is the better choice. Unless the HD-DVD camp can get more studios to release HD-DVD titles consumers will have little choice but to buy a Blu-Ray.

Exactly what color is the sky in your world, if 30 secs. from power on until the movie is on screen, is considered 'forever'?

The content providers are starting to realize that a good portion of their business is now hanging onto the hopes of a gaming machine.

Give it a little bit of time. When you consider exactly how fast the $99 players sold out in many locations, the studios can't help but pay attention.

Blu-ray may be the better choice for the studios, but it's a morase of DRM for the consumer (and yes, we all know that both use AACS, but BR goes above and beyond with BD+).

I've found it to be worth the extra money to import movies that are BR exclusive (in the US) on HD DVD, rather than buy them on BR. HD DVD's feature set, has been pretty complete, and comprehensive from the day they launched.

Sorry, but that holds no water.

I have yet to see one HD DVD-exclusive title make its way to the Blu-ray platform.

So-called 'Blu-ray-exclusive' releases can be found all day long internationally as HD DVD releases.

http://forums.highdefdig...d.php?p=45960#post45960

No, the content providers are not going to determine the outcome of this 'war'... consumers are. It has already been proven that HD DVD has more content than Blu-ray.

As you can see, the boys over at blu-ray.com told him to knock off the name calling as it's cause more HD-DVD player sales than he can count.

Now he's trying to appear slightly intellectual. Has anyone ever heard of speedmeister before today? You can see the pattern, he wants people to return their players as he had said it in two diffent posts and also in the other "Wal-Mart $98 HD-DVD player" story.

This was discussed in public at blu-ray.com but they have been taking down posts before Google can index them. Non the less, people are pasting quotes, especially on AVS.

You are a jack ass. There are tons of great movies on HD. How about that Sony 300 bloray player that won't even output HD sound. I thought that was the point of the format. And to that it's obsolete and still on the shelves for what $400.

Once the studios see HD taking off they will defect to HD and rain all over your sad parade. Good try though troll.

Slightly that is a stretch. :)

I wish it were a strech. Sadly it's true. Go and read some of the recent posts over there. It's like a US Gov. war room being run by the Three Stooges.

A lot of members have been told to knock off the "HD-DUD" name calling and outright lying to sway undecided people to BD because it's "hurting the format".

It's because people are quoting BD fanboys and thier rediculous claims and they are now showing up on Google when you search Blu-Ray or HD-DVD.

People who don't know better think it's the official Blu-Ray website and see what a bunch of idiots they all are and equate BD with moron fanboys.

They are getting nervous because some of thier quotes have been showing up on major websites and blogs. The mods have been deleting posts quite a bit lately.

I'm not even going to comment of these sorts of posts anymore. I'm guessing because betanews shows up in google before blu-ray.com they are putting some sort of plan in action
So everytime one of you ****ers decides to try and misinform, I'm just going to something simple like INCORRECT, MISINFORMATION & FLAT OUT LIE

Hehe it is true actually :)
Google indexing works in mysterious ways.

You people know I'm not one for kicking people in the nuts while they are down..... oh who the hell am I bullsh!tting.

Microsofts gaming division profits are up 25% due to the "Halo effect". Console sales are way up since Halo launch as well as other gaming titles and peripherals.

Sorry Joey / Steve / Dave.

Now all that's left is to step in his neck if WB goes HD-DVD.

You can bet a lot of people who visit BetaNews and read the BD garbage have bought cheap HD-DVD players today just based on reading Joey / Dave's posts and visiting blu-ray.com

I see there is a lot of new HD-DVD customers in here already. You won't be sorry, especially at today's prices.

I would personally like to thank our resident BD shill at doing an excellent job of turning everybody away from Blu-Ray.

Let's give our boy a huge round of applause for doing the exact opposite of his "mission" from blu-ray.com

I see a few posts from poeple who bought an A2 today just to spite him.

*claps enthusiastically*

I didn't even bother reading the entire page-long anti-HD-DVD rant posted by Joey Deacon. It's completely irrelevant and a clear case of sour grapes. What does it matter if Toshiba loses money on every HD-DVD player they sell? Sony is selling their PS3 at a GIGANTIC loss, yet you don't see the Sony zealots complaining. Cheaper HD-DVD players simply mean the consumer wins. Plain and simple.

I know it's hard to swallow yet another huge blow to Blu-Ray, after constantly using lame phrases like "fire sale" and such, but deal with it. Blu-Ray is done for this holiday season. You can spew your Sony propaganda all you want, people will buy the cheaper product. The whole "fire sale" and "desperate move" scare tactic from the Sony camp is just low. HD-DVD is backed by many multi-national multi-billion dollar companies, and it's here to stay.

Doesnt the 5 free movies for HD-DVD expire on 10/31/07?

http://www.thelookandsou...perfectoffer_advert.pdf

nevermind, was an old link

What's wrong Joey, did you run out of lies and FUD of your own?

Looks like the Smurfs had to go straight to Papa Smurf to attempt to counter a blow this massive.

http://thedigitalbits.com/#mytwocents

How in the world does Toshiba think it's ever going to make any money from the HD-DVD format? I mean, seriously.

You may have heard by now that Toshiba has made pre-Black Friday arrangements with Wal-Mart to effectively dump its HD-A2 HD-DVD player starting this Friday (this weekend only) for just $98.87. You may also have heard that Best Buy has followed suit. Supplies are limited, of course, and the offer is apparently not valid in some parts of the country that have state anti-dumping laws.

Wikipedia defines dumping as "the act of a manufacturer in one country exporting a product to another country at a price which is either below the price it charges in its home market or is below its costs of production." Toshiba's move isn't really anti-competitive, because there are no U.S. manufacturers making HD-DVD players. But it's that "below its costs of production" part that applies in this case. The HD-A2 arrived in the States with an original MSRP of $499.99. Now, Toshiba is letting it go for just $99. There's no way the player cost less than $100 to manufacturer. Just. No. Way.

You might wonder: How can Toshiba possibly have enough HD-A2s left to sell at just $99 at large, nationwide retailers? Simple. It's because they didn't sell originally, so plenty of stores still have them sitting on shelves, gathering dust. Toshiba is eager to clear them all out at this point, and Wal-Mart and Best Buy are happy to help.

Clearly, the HD-DVD camp understands that low price is really the only card they have left to play in this format war. Porn hasn't won the war for them as predicted, nor have online bells and whistles, or combo discs/players. The obvious question would be: Why in the world would any other hardware manufacturer want to join Toshiba's foolhardy strategy of driving player prices down to next to nothing? It's no accident that not a single other major manufacturer has released a stand-alone HD-DVD player (and no, the Venturer doesn't count). Given how dramatically Toshiba has slashed prices on HD-DVD players over the last year, you have to wonder how long they can keep losing money.

Forget for a moment that the HD-A2 isn't capable of delivering full 1080p video - that doesn't matter. Why? Because anyone who is so price sensitive that they wait until a high-def player price hits $99 to buy one isn't likely to have an HDTV set yet. Being super bargain shoppers, they aren't likely to want to pay $30 for an HD-DVD movie either. I'd bet many of the people who jump on this sale will either be using them primarily as upconverting DVD players, or they're already diehard HD-DVD supporters and are buying them as second players. For those regular consumers who take the bait, I wonder how they'll feel when they realize they can't play those big Disney titles in the "blu" boxes due next week.

Speaking of which... a couple weeks ago, when Disney and Sony launched the successful strategy of counter-selling their Blu-ray software titles 2 for 1 the same week Paramount and DreamWorks released Transformers on HD-DVD, we got a few e-mails from HD-DVD fans telling us how lame that was. Is it any accident that Toshiba didn't wait for Black Friday to sell their $99 players, instead carefully planning the 3-day sale for the weekend before Disney and Pixar release Cars, Ratatouille and the Pixar Short Films Collection on Blu-ray? Not a chance. So Toshiba is slashing HD-DVD hardware prices to counteract the release of blockbuster Blu-ray software. What does that tell you about the viability of HD-DVD going into a fourth quarter that, by all accounts, is make or break for the format? (Especially with Warner Home Video now hinting that they're looking at the fourth quarter to "reevaluate" their dual format support)

There's no doubt that thousands of eager consumers will get a deal on cheap hardware this weekend. But it still isn't going to be the format war winner for HD-DVD that some would like to believe. On the contrary, it means that Toshiba is getting desperate enough to adopt an all-or-nothing strategy... and is going even more deeply into the red with this format. Meanwhile, given the strength of their rhetoric this week, it's a safe bet that the Blu-ray camp will pull their gloves off too in the fourth quarter, and start getting more aggressive in the weeks and months ahead.

It boggles the mind to think that any reasonable person can still believe at this point that the HD-DVD format represents a viable long-term business. Even if Toshiba's strategy has the desired effect (which seems primarily to be garnering splashy headlines in the press), what do they ultimately win? A tie? The best case for HD-DVD, even if Warner were to be so impressed by this sale that they go HD exclusive, would be to effectively create a 50/50 split in terms of studio support. In other words, a total quagmire. High prices were the number one reason most surveyed consumers cited for staying away from high-def discs in the recent NPD Group survey, but the existence of two competing formats was not far behind. And just as many people who said that price was their chief concern also said that they're happy enough with current DVD to have no interest in upgrading to high-def discs anyway. So all this seems to be more a battle waged for the press and PR spin than the actual hearts and minds of consumers.

Keep in mind, contrary to the opinions of some online, we don't think HD-DVD is a bad format at all. If it were the only HD format around, we'd be all over it here at The Bits. But Toshiba is effectively paying studios to support it, and now they're practically giving the hardware and software away. Do you suppose we'll see free HD-DVD player offers in Cracker Jacks and cereal boxes next? $50 players? $25 players? 2 for 1 players?

Experienced fighter pilots will tell you that when you dive your aircraft at the deck, you very quickly run out of maneuvering room. It seems to me that the ground is coming up awfully fast for HD-DVD. Either way, it's looking more and more as if this fourth quarter could decide the format war... one way or another.

And to think... there was once a time when we all hoped that these two sides would work out their differences and create a single, unified high-def disc format. Those were the days, as they say.

Back with more later. Stay tuned...

Joe,

It all depends, on Warner Bros, If they go blu ray It will be a big hit to the HD DVD, if they go HD DVD the war will be close to a end.

One agree with you is how the hell does either of these formats supposed to make a profit after all they have spent.

You couldn't just link the article could you, had to post the entire thing here. Nice going brainiac. Besides, Bill Hunt has about as much credibility as you. One shill quoting another, sad times indeed.

Forget for a moment that the HD-A2 isn't capable of delivering full 1080p video - that doesn't matter. Why? Because no one can tell the difference, and most sets do the conversion anyway..

There, fixed that for him. This is an entry level player anyway. What a douche. Maybe he can tell us why it's ok for Sony to sell the PS3 at below cost, but if Toshiba does it they are going to go out of business. Apparently he doesn't have the ability to look very far ahead.

Yeah he is an expert in the field. What an idiot.

One agree with you is how the hell does either of these formats supposed to make a profit after all they have spent.

You have to spend money to get your foot in the door. The money is going to come from movie sales, just as it comes from game sales with consoles. You have to get your consoles or players out there first though. This is also a battle to get Warner. These things are much more important right now than making a profit. The profits come later.

"Back with more later. Stay tuned..."

Oooooo... I am waiting in eager anticipation for more "enlightenment" from you, Dave. Don't keep me waiting long!
/sarcasm

"MY TWO CENTS - 11/1/07 - by Digital Bits editor Bill Hunt"

Two cents? Seems to me that this shill is over-paid...

/sarcasm

Sony plant.

Thanks that helped sort it out.

I think jd's comment is sound. Good thing I am neutral still...I'll wait until mid next year.

What? $99 isn't cheap enought for you? Yipes.

That wasn't Joeys post, he stole the whole thing from a raving BD fanatic over at engadget.

Oh yeah... those huge Disney releases. You know, the 4 seasonal releases due next year as well... the whole year.

That's a good reason to pay more than twice as much for a BD player. *sigh*

Reading this person's tripe is clear evidence where you drones get the vast majority of your tired material.

Exactly. This guy used to be all over HD DVD, until one magical morning when he decided all of a sudden to plant his lips firmly on the BDA's hind quarters.

It's clear to me where the Blu-ray Smurfs get all their material and bitterness from... Bill "Papa Smurf" Hunt.

Now lets say this were gasoline, or fuel oil ... if for once one of them "dumped" it on the market, versus dumping it in the sea ... would there be any complaints - or better put, would you complain ?

Why are you so anti-consumer ?

I am sure you are not - you just like the attention from your post, that is all.

Because it is not his religion that is being dumped on the people.

Wasnt from the blu ray shill over at the digital bits? You know they guy they want for President!

how's toshiba the only company making hd-dvd when i seen some rca's at walmart? and why doesn't the venturer over at target count???

UGH Joey,
DVD players are supposed to be LOSS leaders.. Toshiba is making money off of the licensing of HD DVD itself, which they basically control.

It's almost comical how Blu-ray fans are handling this. It's flat out denial. Nobody can believe that people are actually buying these for the PRICE.. not FEATURES, or CONTENT... etc.

It's been price all along. Now Sony needs to do what it needs to do, and COMPETE. Or else, HD DVD could end up winning just because some bigwigs in Tokyo couldn't bring themselves to actually deal with the NON-enthusiast.

That's where the money is.

whoa whoa whoa.. WB going HD DVD exclusive wouldn't end it at all. It would just prolong it.

BR still has Fox, which is a huge studio....

Pitty you didnt think of that, had to take it from someone else. I suppose it was you who posted it on blu-ray.com as well?

The crazier just keep getting crazier. It's amazing
"I'd bet many of the people who jump on this sale will either be using them primarily as upconverting DVD players, or they're already diehard HD-DVD supporters and are buying them as second players"
Get real dude seriously GET REAL

Yeah spot on, I noticed that as well :) And its been doing the rounds around forums too lol.

Which are finally starting to come out with some interesting stuff. Which makes me wonder why on earth they didnt do all this before

You are a complete moron, where are the facts surrounding your bulls*** claim that people buying HD-DVD can't afford HDTVs?

"Because anyone who is so price sensitive that they wait until a high-def player price hits $99 to buy one isn't likely to have an HDTV set yet. Being super bargain shoppers, they aren't likely to want to pay $30 for an HD-DVD movie either. I'd bet many of the people who jump on this sale will either be using them primarily as upconverting DVD players, or they're already diehard HD-DVD supporters and are buying them as second players. For those regular consumers who take the bait, I wonder how they'll feel when they realize they can't play those big Disney titles in the "blu" boxes due next week."

I have two, one 48" HDTV and one 132" HDTV. Yeah, I said 132". Guess what I just bought HD-DVD today because it wasn't stupid expensive, and if Blu-ray wasn't $400 I'd buy it too. $30 HD-DVDs? so what, my TV probably cost more than your car. I (and most consumers, go figure) am not going to support a stupid format war (IE: Betamax vs VHS_, it has nothing to do with money. HD-DVD for the same price as an up-converting DVD player? Well it would be pretty damn silly to buy the DVD player instead now wouldn't it. Bingo, HD-DVD just won a really big battle in the format war, not only did they get the attention of us informed consumers, they gave us value in pricing HD-DVD at the very same price as a high end up-converting DVD player oh and look it's also an up-converting DVD player too. 'nuff said.

DVD players are disposable, and the market couldn't care less about Blu-ray OR HD-DVD because they are both A: stupid expensive, and B: competing formats like that last standard was. People still feel the burn from throwing away their $800 Betamax players, or are you too young to remember that? There are even players out now that play both, but well it's still $500+ for an unknown. I dunno about you but $400 (the current MINUMUM price of Blu-ray) is a lot of cash to spend on a lotto ticket which is what you do if you buy right now. HD-DVD just figured that out, and took a significant chunk of the market today. HD-DVD even at 1080I for $99 is an absolute win-win for the consumer since it's the exact same price as all the other high-end DVD players on the shelf. Maybe if you took your head out of your a** you'd see that, but meh.

Since you ignored my earlier comment in the wal-mart article earlier today let me re-post that link in it for you:

Something interesting I stumbled across the other day:
http://blog.compete.com/...28/netflix-bluray-hddvd

Thanks for playing.

I think the general consensus (at least the way I see it) is that it would be a bigger blow to Blu-ray if Warner were to move the to HD DVD side of the fence exclusively than if the opposite were the case.

If Warner were to side exclusively with Blu-ray, would it not stand to reason that a good number of Warner titles would still be available for HD DVD via imported international releases? It is a practice that quite a few of the more staunch HD DVD supporters already take advantage of. I cannot think of a single HD DVD-exclusive release that is also available on Blu-ray through import channels.

I agree, Fox is a huge studio, but although their support for Blu-ray does not necessarily seem to be wavering, their releases on that format seem to have slacked off recently. Sure, if Warner sided with HD DVD, the studio support would effectively be split down the middle between the two camps. However, with Warner being one of the largest (if not the largest) studio, it would tip the scales heavily in favor of HD DVD as far as available content is concerned.

As long as Warner (and any other studio for that matter) stays neutral, that is what is truly prolonging this "war". Siding with HD DVD would help bring it to a close more quickly, I believe.

Again, it's just what seems logical to me... I could be wrong.

You realise they are rebadged Toshibas right?

Proof, post proof. You'll convince no-one otherwise.

He has since become an expert in Blu-ray FUD and spin.

He's become the Al Sharpton of the Blu-ray drones.

"Mr. Hunt, why have you not graced us with your wisdom yet on this matter? We need your guidance!"

Pathetic...

http://www.htdude.com/archives/313

I agree Ed, but just the appearance of two major neutral studios going HD-DVD only is a great sales pitch.

As soon as people on the fence heard this (if it happened), it would be easy to make a decision.

That has got to be the biggest load of crap I have ever seen.

...and a cut & paste, no less.

*laughing*

Made my day, man. Pure comic genius.

My samsung up converter was 99$ ... I guess I should've waited.

I find this real funny, sony keeps saying the BD is selling so well but when I keep reading these articles I see that out of every ten or so HD DVD supporters there is one BD supporter.

So were does sony get there numbers?

The same place that the shills on this site do...

outtatheirass.com

I just wish I could remember who (on here) first coined this, so I could give them proper credit.

I wish I could too. When I used it, it wasn't original. I wouldn't mind giving props either. :)

Sony gets these numbers from sales of PS3's - multi-tier statistics; there you have it. One segment contributes to another. Double counted if you may. I won't say it's cheating, but whatever ...

That may be, but since you introduced it to me...take your credit.

Bah... never! It helps me sleep better at night. :)

EDIT: Ah hah! And the winner is... terminalx!

http://www.betanews.com/...in_September/1192808111

LOL

Best Buy is substituting A3's for A'2 while supplies last. I just read it over at AVS.

Poor Joey.

If you ordered an A2 and it's on backorder, they are now showing the SKU for the A3 and shipping those.

If Warner goes HD-DVD only this weekend, it's officially over. BD is merely a storage medium.

If they go BD exclusive, this will drag out for a long, long time. Cheap combo's are they key for a lot of people. No choosing, just enjoying any movie in HD.

Ok, screw it, I've jsut decided to pick up the A3 soon, the 7 movies alone pays for the player.

Hollywood, anyone.

Whats the difference between the A2 and A3? And can I take advantage of the 7 free movies on both players?

I'm buying either today, I just want to know if theres a great significance spec wise on the A3 over the A2.

Make sure you ship to a different address on the second one per household you will be declined for the second one.

Plague, the A3 is pretty much the replacement for the A2, I don't know every detail though.

Still 1080i but if your TV does 1080p conversion, it doesn't matter.

As far as what I've read so far, I believe the differences are mostly cosmetic.

As far as I know the A3 is just a minor revision to the A2. It is a bit smaller and has a different appearance but they are pretty much the same feature wise. I would just go for whichever you find the best deal on.

any BD devotees know of any planned BD player counter sale? I really want to know...I love you all, HDdvd and BD fans ;)

Yes, Sony is planning a 20% price cut on certain BD players. That's pretty much it.

I respect your position, but (and no offense) there is no need to suck up to either side here. There is no fear of being banned on a whim like on blu-ray.com just for mentioning the "other format". :)

It will probably be the outdated 1.0 players that cannot be upgraded. :D

Of course it will. Sony has to dump those on somebody. Who would want a non 1.1 player now that "all" players manufactured after October 31st are supposed to be 1.1 spec?

Of couse the rules don't apply to Sony as all post 10/31 PS3's now have to be 1.1 compliant. They will continue to crank out crippled 40GB versions and promise "the firmware is coming".

I'm guessing its only going to be the high end players since prics are still not going to drop below $400 aparently.

Or, like Samsung, all they have to do is release a player that they promise is capable of it now... just not right now.

Shady business practices indeed.

Soon .... Only Not Yet

September? October? Next Year? :)

As for "real world", I picked up one today and spread the news around and know at least 3 more people that will be going to buy one when they leave work. That makes 4 people that were waiting to see which way it would fall, and have jumped onto the HD-DVD boat. Good-bye ol Blu!

So these HD-DVD players with powerful converters and Ethernet port... Do any of these things support media streaming from a UPnP server or similar?

I doubt it. It's not listed in any of the specs.

No and why should they?

Don't you just wonder why toshiba/Microsoft couldn't have put in a few more $$$ to get this down faster, knowing there was absolutely no way the BD camp could subsidize anymore than they already are...

I do believe Microsoft would like this to take a long time to decide, or else they would have pushed a little harder. However, my $98 players will be just fine for my 1080i sets... Watching Trans and 300 again this weekend just to enjoy it again! This time in HD.

You'll love transformers in HD, 300 however is grainy (on purpose). But still transformers is definitely the movie to show off to friends from a visual stand point.

not only is sony taking a bath in the game market (and i am big on sony. i'm one of the rare people that hasn't had their player disc read error on them yet) but the way i see it their multimedia console won't even be able to play any new hd movies in the future, not unless bd players are close enough to hddvds that they can read them.

knowing sony, they were probably arrogant enough to consider cross compatibility. looking forward to the future bd burning/hddvd player that will come on the market.

i just can't stop smiling

"Sony Electronics President Stan Glasgow said prices of Blu-ray players will not likely fall below $400."

Sure they will! PlayStation 3, starting at $399. :)

Hence the already predetermined death of Blu-ray this holiday season. Yet another mistake of this arrogant and greedy corporation.

Of all the advantages of HD DVD over Blu-ray, the one that counts the most to the overwhelming majority of consumers is price, and Sony is going to get slaughtered in that area. Name recognition and brand loyalty can only be stretched so thin.

Sure they will! PlayStation 3, starting at $399

Oh man, I thought you were serious for a second. :D

Heh. :)

The Sony shills will talk studios but in reality if the numbers grow the other studios will start producing for HD DVD. They are after all a business looking for the dollar. They will follow the money. I don't care if the studio is blu if the other side sells like crazy they will go the other way. That also goes the other way too.

Things are looking very good for HD hopefully they will continue to expand from this.

Awesome I hope the A35 drops too. I would like to have the little light on my receiver for HD sound come on.

Wow, I just wish we could see these kinds of prices here in the UK.

$98 for the HD A2 is only £49 ffs, the HD A3 @ $199 is £99.

Incredible prices.

The retail industry have called this, it's HD DVD.

Blu-ray will be a game meduim (for those that remain & bother producing PS3 games) and the new UMD.
They just can't compete.

You people got it all wrong! Blu-Ray is and will win the format war! Its only a matter of time.

You know nothing.

Disney, Lionsgate, Sony pictures, Blockbuster, Asus, Apple, Buena Vista, Fox Studios, Hitachi, Dell, Samsung, Sharp, HP, Phillips, Warner Brothers, Panasonic, and Sun Microsystems have just called back and wanted me to pass on a message to you....

Blu-ray is still outselling HD-DVD by 2:1 in the states, and more everywhere else....

and i see how every HD-DVD shill complained about blu-ray giving away copies of movies and counting them as sales, but there is no mention of the LOADS of free HD-DVD's you get when you buy a HD-DVD player...

You know nothing.

Actually I think Blu-Ray might stick around as a blank media format due to the capacity, that is if they can ever get the prices down.

So you mean not only are they winning, but they're going to win, too?

You heard it here first guys and gals... pack it up! Blu-ray's going to win twice!

All the new units sold and that number will remain the same you are an idiot to think that.

You get the same free disks with the blo ray so be quite.

You post stinks of desperation, move along.

Your right just like they did with UMD, mini disk, sacd and many others. Why didn't $ony make it so the PS3 could play UMD's if their stuff is so good?

Your right time will tell that you are wrong.

*laughing*

Wow, so my HD-DVD addon for the 360 is offically dead? Well bloody hell... lol

I think blu-ray will be dead long before stand alone burners are affordable. But I do agree, I would prefer blu-ray for blank media.

Go cry somewhere else jagoff.

Joe why do you do so much for sony? It seems like you are being paid by them. Are you?

There are so many other things you can be doing now, posting her will just mean the you will be killed my 20 or so HD DVD fans.

All that support and blu-ray only just managed to hold a 2-1 lead? wow :)

Stay tuned to this station, I get the impression that things are finally changing

HD-DVD is going to really take off at these prices. Blu-Ray is simply priced too high.

The HD-A2 is sold out everywhere, all the walmarts I went to/called had around 20 units, and all were gone. I found the last two, and bought them... now sending off my rebate offer to get my 10 free movies :)

Make sure the rebates have different ship to address or you'll only get one. Only one per household. You've been warned.

Both of my Wal-Marts were already sold out of the HD-A2 by the time I had the chance to swing by. :(

Oh well, the A3 is next... unless the A30 or A35 come down in price like this.

got a BB offer for the A3 for 99. and 7 free dvds :). Sold the two A2 I picked up at WM