Login:
Password:

Could Google Unravel the Microsoft + Justice Dept. Accord?

By Scott M. Fulton, III, BetaNews

June 11, 2007, 12:25 PM

The New York Times revealed Saturday that Google was the unidentified party mentioned in a US Dept. of Justice status report last March as having lodged a "middleware-related complaint" against Microsoft. That revelation raised perhaps zero eyebrows in the technology community, who could file that fact under "D" for "Duh."

But a memo by a key antitrust enforcement official that the Times also turned up, rejecting Google's arguments and advising states' prosecutors to reject them as well, has raised some legal eyebrows over whether the relationship between the DOJ and Microsoft has grown too cozy.

At least one of Google's complaints is apparently, once again, that Internet Explorer 7 and other Windows Vista services that rely upon it, install Windows Live Search as their default search engine. One such service is Windows Desktop Search, which amends the search page with locally indexed content, and which Google reportedly says cannot be turned off.

When Google's Desktop Search is installed, Google alleges, the simultaneous operation of both indexing engines slows down Vista tremendously, the end effect being that the 2002 settlement agreement between Microsoft and the DOJ is violated.

The question at hand is the degree to which Microsoft's own built-in tools and options should make way for competitors who have the right to produce tools for those same market spaces, without interference from Microsoft. Assistant Attorney General Thomas O. Barnett, a former partner in a firm representing Microsoft prior to joining the DOJ, had officially recused himself from this case for that reason. Still, the Times reported, he authored a memo to states' prosecutors defending Microsoft, the content of which has not yet been revealed.

If Barnett made any technical claims in that memo, there are several available ones from which he could have borrowed, which may have merit. For example, tests reveal that IE7 only installs Live Search when no other pre-existing choice appears in the Registry - for instance, from IE6. And first-time IE7 and Vista users already know well that the default first-time launch pages immediately give users the option of overriding whatever that choice may have been, with a new choice from a selection that includes Google.

But tests with a clean install of Vista did reveal that MSN Search (now Windows Live Search) was placed in the System Registry, prior to giving the user the option to override that entry. As Microsoft explained at the time, the Registry has to provide something, and for reliability purposes, it can't be something at random. However, OEMs are given the tools and the opportunity to override this default setting themselves, should they make deals with Google, Yahoo, Ask.com, or anyone else.

Our recent check of Vista does validate Google's claim that Windows Desktop Search cannot be turned off in Vista, in the same way it can be uninstalled from Windows XP. However, a Microsoft spokesperson told the Seattle Post-Intelligencer's Todd Bishop over the weekend that his company scales back its own indexing services when other indexing tools are being used.

[UPDATE - As our regular reader PC_Tool correctly points out, however, Windows Desktop Search is a service that can be disabled, although the procedure for doing so isn't self-evident. You can only disable it with administrative privileges. Click on the Start button, then in the Administrative Tools menu, select Run as Administrator. Verify yourself through User Account Control, then in the Services window, under Name, right-click on Windows Search. Then from the popup, select Stop.]

There is also the little affair of Google having reached an agreement with Apple in 2004 to be the default search provider for Safari for the Mac. Some Mac users have complained that this setting is also difficult to override.

But the very fact that it is Barnett who wrote the memo may be prompting states' prosecutors and attorneys general to distance themselves from the DOJ's defense of Microsoft, and perhaps pursue complaints against Microsoft on the state level.

The Microsoft spokesperson told the Seattle P-I that it may be willing to make limited concessions to address the new batch of Google complaints.

Add a Comment (12 Comments)

BetaNews reserves the right to remove any comment at any time for any reason. Please keep your responses appropriate and on topic. Foul language and personal attacks will not be tolerated.

Name (required):

E-mail (required):

Enter Your Comment:

By horsecharles

edited Jun 12, 2007 - 11:25 AM

Duplicate.

Score: 0

By Hidden_Agenda

edited Jun 11, 2007 - 2:52 PM

Microsoft should be allowed to include whatever they deem fit in their software. If you do not like said features then don’t use Vista, XP, or other Microsoft products. Sure, it would be nice to have an option to disable, but it should not be something you should demand or expect. Regardless, Google has absolutely NO room to talk with all the software and new systems out there that are, by default, bundling their toolbars, desktop search, etc for them. It just seems a tad hypocritical if you ask me.

Score: 0

By horsecharles

edited Jun 12, 2007 - 11:30 AM

By Hidden_Agenda edited Jun 11, 2007 - 2:52 PM

"Microsoft should be allowed to include whatever they deem fit in their software. If you do not like said features then don’t use Vista, XP, or other Microsoft products..."

You're kidding, right?!!!!

1. What other OS can we use, that runs the plethora of programs we and the majority of folks are accustomed to-- that we also need when interfacing with the software / systems of others?

2. Yes, MS can bundle anything else they wish
into the OS...but those rights are of necessity modified because it has an almost total monopoly.

3. I have the right to choose a bundled app or someone else's-- ESPCIALLY when said bundled app is of inferior quality / contains less features.

4. Yes, third parties are on their own as far as making sure their app interfaces with the OS, but you can't allow a monopolist underhanded measures to block competing products-- which not only hurt their foes, but the end cosumer: YOU!, as well as me.

5. As for hipocricy-- I have not seen ONE instance of a Google product that is not opt-in / up-front... and once installed, not able to be removed w/o having to resort to advanced technical knowledge / measures.

Score: 0

By PC_Tool

posted Jun 12, 2007 - 2:18 PM


1. What other OS can we use, that runs the plethora of programs we and the majority of folks are accustomed to-- that we also need when interfacing with the software / systems of others?


Endless varieties of Linux (Wine, Cedega, etc...)
MacOSX.

Take yer pick.

2. Yes, MS can bundle anything else they wish
into the OS...but those rights are of necessity modified because it has an almost total monopoly.


So... Let's protect the business model of of software devs who cannot innovate and adapt like we're protecting the business model of the **AAs? Sounds like a plan.

3. I have the right to choose a bundled app or someone else's-- ESPCIALLY when said bundled app is of inferior quality / contains less features.

Sure do. If you don't like it, turn it off, uninstall it, or don't buy it. Choice is great, eh?

4. Yes, third parties are on their own as far as making sure their app interfaces with the OS, but you can't allow a monopolist underhanded measures to block competing products-- which not only hurt their foes, but the end cosumer: YOU!, as well as me.

There isn't a dev in the world who couldn't figure it out given time. Kernel is still locked in Vista but Symantec is still making money. Funny how that works, eh?

5. As for hipocricy-- I have not seen ONE instance of a Google product that is not opt-in / up-front... and once installed, not able to be removed w/o having to resort to advanced technical knowledge / measures.

Maybe because they aren't part of the OS. Windows Desktop Search *is*. It is merely an extension (rewrite) of the indexing function that's been around in Windows for years now. As for advanced tech knowledge? Depends on your definition of "advanced". Typing "services" in the search box and disabling "Windows Search Service" doesn't seem all that difficult to me.

Score: 0

By amanda77kr

edited Jun 11, 2007 - 1:25 PM

Microsoft should provide a way to turn off their indexing feature. Perhaps a user is used to another type, such as Google, or just prefers not to use Microsoft's. That, to me, is poor design.

Honestly, Microsoft should promote it's own website as a default for searching and for home page, because that's good business. Just as long as they don't make it difficult to change those settings. That's the key.

I agree with PC_Tool's post that MS is in the right on this one, though I usually am anti-MS. However, it does smack of something underhanded when the DOJ reacts as it has.

Score: 0

By PC_Tool

posted Jun 11, 2007 - 2:08 PM

Microsoft should provide a way to turn off their indexing feature.

Click the globe, type Services, disable Windows Search Service, reboot. :)

Score: 0

By Scotch Moose

posted Jun 11, 2007 - 2:27 PM

An army of Google phd's says it can't be turned off but the tool thinks it can. I'll play the odds and bet that Microsoft punishes users for choosing a competing disk search product.

Score: 0

By xyzcb1

posted Jun 12, 2007 - 10:08 AM

If someone like myself can turn off index, I am questioning Google's Ph'd qualification.

Score: 0

By PC_Tool

posted Jun 12, 2007 - 2:12 PM

If someone like myself can turn off index, I am questioning Google's Ph'd qualification.

QFT.

Score: 0

By PC_Tool

posted Jun 11, 2007 - 4:04 PM

lmao...

Thinks it can?

Sorry, pal. It can. Easy as that. Disable that service and indexing is gone.

You'll still have the search bars in all yer windows, but Windows will no longer index your system. Install Google Desktop Search and have fun.

Don't believe me? Install Vista and try it yourself.

Want to continue to believe anything you want so long as it lets you think MS=Evil? Go for it. It's been working for ya so far.

Score: 0

By xyzcb1

posted Jun 11, 2007 - 1:41 PM

I think I could sue Dell and Google for install Google Desktop on my new Dell. Didn't give me a choice. I didn't ask for it.

I will also sue Mozilla and Google for default Google on my default search engine.

Both instants didn't offer me an option to opt for another engine, it is the DEFAULT.

Score: 0

By PC_Tool

posted Jun 11, 2007 - 12:38 PM

Ouch.

You could say Desktop Search is simply an OS feature, and while there may have been a reason for third parties to try and fill that space while it was missing in XP, in Vista, they should have no such claim.

MacOSX has it built in to the OS. There's precedent right there.

I'm usually pro-Google, but I believe MS is in the right on this one. It's a feature that other OSes include by default, MS should not be disallowed from doing the same just because Google wants the space.

Score: 0